View Full Version : Appliance delivery boy electricuted last night
Got a call last night from a frequent landlord client of mine. She said that the appliance man got electricuted and left the premises, and now the tenant doesnt have any heat in the house. And also she said "by the way, I want you to rebuild the service as soon as you can".....:rolleyes:
So I got there, I asked what happend...the tennant said that they rented a dryer from a rent-to-own place, and the delivery guy had to put the cord on the dryer. Then he had to make an adjustment to the connection and it shocked him really bad, and he left. So I asked, "he did this while it was plugged in"? and they said yes....
So after checking checking around with my trusty wiggy, I find that there is no 240v in the house, only one leg or phase is hot, the other is very weak. So this leaves the hvac and the dryer unfunctional...
So this eventualy takes me out to the pole in the back yard, and I find a loose kearney at the weatherhead. No problem so I unload the meter,pull it, tighten the connection...then I start noticeing, what to me is a suprise.
No main breaker at the pole, its been removed !!
Where the triplex lands on the house from the pole, it kearneys onto a #10 wire (among other unprotected connections) which was previously dead. This wire is unprotected and enters the house via going right into the mortar (limestone rock house) then goes across the length of the house via attic to the duo pack hvac unit with No protectection what so ever.
I reluctantely got the peoples "heat on", but called the landlord, and told her that she had a severe liability and it needed to be fixed asap....she said get-r-done
This make two of these type calls, Ive received this week...what keeps these people from being killed?
In this day and time, I wouldnt own one of those ratty ole rent house's for fear of being sued for may various reasons....couldnt sleep at night, knowing what I know.:rolleyes:
roger
11-09-2008, 11:03 AM
Well, to be correct, the delivery boy just got shocked, if he had been electrocuted he wouldn't have left with out being on a gurney. :)
Roger
Got a call last night from a frequent landlord client of mine. She said that the appliance man got electricuted and left the premises,
If he got "electrocuted" he left more than just the premises. :D
If he got "electrocuted" he left more than just the premises. :D
You guys are correct, I was just using the language that they relayed to me....
mdshunk
11-09-2008, 11:13 AM
You guys are correct, I was just using the language that they relayed to me....
PA is one state that can still put people in the electric chair for the death penalty. The death warrant will read "electrocuted until dead", so I guess you can electrocute someone and not kill them.
From Wiki, take it or leave it:
"Electrocution is also frequently used incorrectly to refer only to a fatal electric shock. However, non-fatal electrocutions are a common household injury. Always use caution when dealing with live voltage."
chris kennedy
11-09-2008, 11:17 AM
live voltage.
As opposed to...?
mdshunk
11-09-2008, 11:19 AM
As opposed to...?
I was heckling one of those power save gadget guys at a home show over the summer who was talking about "cold electricity". I guess cold electricity is the opposite of live voltage?
PA is one state that can still put people in the electric chair for the death penalty. The death warrant will read "electrocuted until dead", so I guess you can electrocute someone and not kill them.
My guess was the kid, got shocked pretty good, and was rattled behond continueing....:rolleyes: But it just really amazes me at the amount of un-trained people coming into harms way, and it further amazes me at the amount of dangerous wiring that exist.....this kid had NO protection, other than the stinger fuse at the transformer. The amount of AIC was up there
nolabama
11-09-2008, 11:21 AM
is cold electricity made from cold fusion?:D
mdshunk
11-09-2008, 11:23 AM
is cold electricity made from cold fusion?:D
No, I'm pretty sure he said it had something to do with splitting the negative pole of a magnet?? Snake oil salesmen; gotta love them. Most of the people listening to the pitch seemed to be eating it up.
dictionary results for: electrocuted
Dictionary.com Unabridged (v 1.1) - Cite This Source - Share This
e⋅lec⋅tro⋅cute /ɪˈlɛktrəˌkyut/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [i-lek-truh-kyoot] Show IPA Pronunciation
–verb (used with object), -cut⋅ed, -cut⋅ing.
1. to kill by electricity.
2. to execute (a criminal) by electricity, as in an electric chair.
nolabama
11-09-2008, 11:28 AM
p t barnum said it best - their is one born every minute
mdshunk
11-09-2008, 11:28 AM
dictionary results for: electrocuted
Dictionary.com Unabridged (v 1.1) - Cite This Source - Share This
e⋅lec⋅tro⋅cute /ɪˈlɛktrəˌkyut/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [i-lek-truh-kyoot] Show IPA Pronunciation
–verb (used with object), -cut⋅ed, -cut⋅ing.
1. to kill by electricity.
2. to execute (a criminal) by electricity, as in an electric chair.
I've flipped open a couple of my wife's nursing books, and I've found two so far that have "electrocution injury" in the index. If you're injured, you're not dead, are you? Not saying, just asking.
charlie
11-09-2008, 11:33 AM
From Merriam-Webster Unabridged © 2000, I don't buy a new dictionary very often. :smile:
1 : to put to death as a legal punishment by causing a fatally large electric current to pass through the body 'electrocute a criminal' 'a person may be electrocuted for treasonable activities in some states'
2 : to kill by electric shock 'the lineman was electrocuted when he happened to touch a power wire'
growler
11-09-2008, 11:38 AM
But it just really amazes me at the amount of un-trained people coming into harms way, and it further amazes me at the amount of dangerous wiring that exist.....this kid had NO protection
Think about it like this, you are the guy that just hooked this death trap back up for them.
There is no way I'm going to leave a circuit hot with no over current protection. Not even temporary. If I don't have the time to do the repair correctly there are lots of other contractors out there.
mdshunk
11-09-2008, 11:41 AM
I got this thing figured out, at least on the medical end. Before 1995, there were classifications for fatal and non-fatal electrocutions. After 1995, electrocution always means fatal, and non-fatal injuries are called "non-fatal effects of electric current".
I'm still a little bit confused, though, because this CDC document from 2002 says, "The individual experienced a non-fatal electrocution using the same piece of equipment approximately 3 months earlier and required hospitalization for his injuries."
http://www.cdc.gov/Niosh/FACE/stateface/mi/02mi152.html
Probably just the pre-1995 nomenclature hanging on.
GUNNING
11-09-2008, 12:00 PM
I'm sure the word Electrocuted would only be important to those trying to figure out how to fill in the blank and not the person electrocuted. As for the breaker missing I would go ahead and tell them I had to replace the main etc etc to fix the problem. The body is not part of my job description. People don't want to know the details just that it's fixed.
bjp_ne_elec
11-09-2008, 12:09 PM
.........leaves the hvac and the dryer unfunctional...
So this eventualy takes me out to the pole in the back yard, and I find a loose kearney at the weatherhead. No problem so I unload the meter,pull it, tighten the connection...then I start noticeing, what to me is a suprise.
No main breaker at the pole, its been removed !!
Where the triplex lands on the house from the pole, it kearneys onto a #10 wire (among other unprotected connections) which was previously dead. This wire is unprotected and enters the house via going right into the mortar (limestone rock house) then goes across the length of the house via attic to the duo pack hvac unit with No protectection what so ever.
Mule - first of all, what are "kearneys"? And if I'm reading this, you worked them "hot"?
Main breaker at the pole? Never heard of such a thing. What POCO? At the pole, the only thing we might see is fuses - but they're not designed to protect the service drops, they generall protect the transformer and it's load.
mdshunk
11-09-2008, 12:13 PM
Mule - first of all, what are "kearneys"?
Slang term for an ordinary split-bolt connector.
cadpoint
11-09-2008, 12:14 PM
October is National Fire Awareness Week.
Seems fitting, change in the weather can effect loose or loosen up stuff!
NFPA (http://www.nfpa.org/newsReleaseDetails.asp?categoryid=488&itemId=39144) is the sponsor
"NFPA has taken the lead in public fire safety outreach by serving as the official sponsor of Fire Prevention Week for 86 years. The annual public awareness and safety commemoration, which is proclaimed by the President of of the
cadpoint
11-09-2008, 12:17 PM
sorry see page
http://www.nfpa.org/newsReleaseDetails.asp?categoryid=488&itemId=39144
for complete quote as sted above...
Mule - first of all, what are "kearneys"? And if I'm reading this, you worked them "hot"?
Main breaker at the pole? Never heard of such a thing. What POCO? At the pole, the only thing we might see is fuses - but they're not designed to protect the service drops, they generall protect the transformer and it's load.
My previous post said that I unloaded the meter and pulled it...so it would not be hot....
We have two Poco's here and this one is primarily rural. They supply a pole, meter loop, and the main breaker enclosure to the customer which is free. The customer only pays for the main breaker. This type of POLE installation facilitates wiring mulitple rural structures...hence the pole in the back yard.
jim dungar
11-09-2008, 05:36 PM
The amount of AIC was up there No, another misuse of words.
The SCA, available fault current, was up there.
AIC is the rating/sizing of a protective device.
No, another misuse of words.
The SCA, available fault current, was up there.
AIC is the rating/sizing of a protective device.
Thanks....:D This old timer, is part hillbilly....Never heard of SCA? standing current available? secondary current available? stupid current awaiting? wild guess I thought AIC was Available Inrush Current...NO?
I bet you knew what I was trying to say....
Maybe this "mule" will someday learn to be punctual......but I doubt it....
jim dungar
11-09-2008, 06:40 PM
Thanks....:D This old timer, is part hillbilly....Never heard of SCA? standing current available? secondary current available? stupid current awaiting? wild guess I thought AIC was Available Inrush Current...NO?
I bet you knew what I was trying to say....
Maybe this "mule" will someday learn to be punctual......but I doubt it....
SCA = usally Short Circuit Amps, althought some call it Short Circuit, Available
AIC = Amps Interrupting Capacity
SCA = usally Short Circuit Amps, althought some call it Short Circuit, Available
AIC = Amps Interrupting Capacity
Oops...thanks be sure and "keep an eye on me"...but Im sure you will
mdshunk
11-09-2008, 06:53 PM
Oops...thanks be sure and "keep an eye on me"...but Im sure you will
Think of AIC as the "heavy duty-ness" of the equipment, much like you can buy 250 volt and 600 volt rated disconnects.
Think of SCA as the actual fault current available.
quogueelectric
11-09-2008, 07:19 PM
It is heartwarming to see an appliance delivery guy who tried to sell a cord to a customer without any credentials to do so get a lesson in electrical theory(non lethal of course). I certainly dont want the little bugger to kill himself. I do want him to get a good enough whack to put the fear of God in him and go back to all of the rest of these appliance guys who take our jobs and let them know what happened to him. It is also good for the customer to see him on the floor doing the funky chicken for thinking of not using a licensed and insured electrician.
bradleyelectric
11-09-2008, 07:28 PM
The cow said "funky chicken" that's funny. I like it.
Think of AIC as the "heavy duty-ness" of the equipment, much like you can buy 250 volt and 600 volt rated disconnects.
Think of SCA as the actual fault current available.
That's the reason those fuses are 200k,....didnt know they could pack that much current in there .....:D
Do disconects come in different ratings? I thought the smaller ones go where you dont have much space....
jim dungar
11-09-2008, 10:06 PM
Think of AIC as the "heavy duty-ness" of the equipment, much like you can buy 250 volt and 600 volt rated disconnects.
Think of SCA as the actual fault current available.
For those that like plumbing analogies.
SCA = amount of fault current available = Gallons of water that can come out of a broken pipe.
AIC = ability to cope with the amount of fault current = how big, in gallons, is the bucket below the broken pipe.
For those that like plumbing analogies.
SCA = amount of fault current available = Gallons of water that can come out of a broken pipe.
AIC = ability to cope with the amount of fault current = how big, in gallons, is the bucket below the broken pipe.
Sounds like a short to me.....:D mixing water and current
Thanks for the education...truely I always thought it was available inrush current
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