Homeline and twin breakers

[ivsenroute]

Which Homeline panels & subs can accept twins?

I have been getting conflicting information from other EC's and the supply house.

[frenchelectrican]

Which Homeline panels & subs can accept twins?

I have been getting conflicting information from other EC's and the supply house.


The most impoart part is read the panel model number that will tell if that will take the "twins" or duplex depending on what ya saying.

If the model number like this example HOM3040M200

The 30 which I underline this that mean 30 fullsized breakers while the 40 which I highlited in bold that mean it can have 20 full size breaker and 10 twinner or duplex breaker.

And typically for twinner { dupex } breaker will be landed on the bottom part of breaker box { some of them will show the diagram for it } and the bussbar tabs will look diffrent as well.

Merci,Marc

[infinity]

We just look at the diagram on the inside of the cover. As Marc said it's usually the bottom breakers. Or just look at the model number.

[electricmanscott]

Which Homeline panels & subs can accept twins?




All of them. ;) So I've heard. :grin:

The label will tell you. If the label is gone the busbar ususally has a "slot" where the twins can be installed.

Maybe a search of the Sq D website will offer useful info.

[ultramegabob]

the "twins" or duplex depending on what ya saying.



"piggyback" and "tandem" are a couple more names for them...

[Dennis Alwon]

Which Homeline panels & subs can accept twins?

I have been getting conflicting information from other EC's and the supply house.

Some panels are not designed to use twins or piggyback breakers.

[ivsenroute]

Yeah, I was all over the SqD website and could not find anything.

I have not been to the homeowner's house yet so I asked him to describe is panel other than what he told me or find a panel number but no help. I just asked him to count the breakers for me before I get there. It is one of those deals where the panel is full according to him and he wants me to show up and do the job but just sheetrocked his garage where the panel is (now he wants to do work). I already warned him that he may need a sub panel.

I guess we will find out when I drive down there on Saturday.

[480sparky]

All of them. ;) So I've heard. :grin:

A model with 2030 and 3040 in the number will, but not a 3030 or 4040. The first half of the number is the number of spaces, the second half is the number of circuits. So a 2030 will have 20 spaces and can have 30 circuits, allowing 10 tandems (usually at the bottom). A 4040 will have 40 spaces for 40 circuits.

You can also look at the bus bars. If they're square and flat across the front edge (the end towards you), then it only accepts full-size breakers. If there's a V-notch in it, it will accept a tandem on either side.

[jim dungar]

A model with 2030 and 3040 in the number will, but not a 3030 or 4040. The first half of the number is the number of spaces, the second half is the number of circuits. So a 2030 will have 20 spaces and can have 30 circuits, allowing 10 tandems (usually at the bottom). A 4040 will have 40 spaces for 40 circuits.
This is partially incorrect.
A Homeline panel that does not accept twins will only have (1) set of digits in its part number like HOM30Mx. A panel that accepts twins will have (2) sets of digits in its number like HOM3040Mx

Look in the Square D Digest on page 1-14.

[ivsenroute]

He just sent me some photos. It is a 30 200 and in the photos I was able to see that there are 2 twins already installed.

[frenchelectrican]

He just sent me some photos. It is a 30 200 and in the photos I was able to see that there are 2 twins already installed.

Becarefull with that one somecase I know someone used non standard twinners in there.

If that is a legit twinner breaker then a good chance you got 3040 model there.

Merci,Marc

[480sparky]

He just sent me some photos. It is a 30 200 and in the photos I was able to see that there are 2 twins already installed.

If it's not installed in the bottom 10 spaces, it's 100% a violation. ;)

[iwire]

From Square D's FAQ

Question If a HOMELINE load centers catalog number cannot be determined, how can you tell if the load center will accept tandem circuit breakers?

Answer Inspect the bus stab that the circuit breaker plug-on jaw connects to. The bus stab that will accept a tandem circuit breaker will be notched in the middle. A solid bus stab will accept full sized circuit breakers only.


Question Why doesn`t a HOMT2020 tandem breaker fit in all Homeline load centers ?

Answer The HOMT breaker has a rejection feature (short notch ) to keep it from fitting in Homeline load centers that are designed and UL listed for non tandem breakers like the HOM120 . Only Homeline load centers that are designed and UL listed for tandem breakers will accept the HOMT Tandem circuit breakers.

[petersonra]

If it's not installed in the bottom 10 spaces, it's 100% a violation. ;)

Why? Or is that just the wya they are made for some reason? I can't imagine why it would be safer for them to be at the bottom somehow.

[jim dungar]

Why? Or is that just the wya they are made for some reason? I can't imagine why it would be safer for them to be at the bottom somehow.

Yes, it is simply how they are made.

[480sparky]

Why? Or is that just the wya they are made for some reason? I can't imagine why it would be safer for them to be at the bottom somehow.

Sq D just puts the v-notched bus bars at the bottom. I 'reckon it's to keep the heavy loads (ie, 2-pole) towards the top so they can dissapate heat better. Other than that, I can't think of any good reason why tandems would be at the bottom.

[ivsenroute]

Job is done, froze my tush off because the work was in the unheated garage and outside. Woke up to 17 deg F this morning.

I added 2 more 20A twins and a new 30A 240 circuit for a garage heater. He is now up to 36 in the panel so he has room for more twins but not many because he has electric baseboard heat.

Did not wear the inspector hat at all today and now I am cold, tires and have more nicks in my hands. :)

[BryanMD]

Did not wear the inspector hat at all today and now I am cold, tires and have more nicks in my hands.

Who inspects the inspector? ;)

[electricmanscott]

A model with 2030 and 3040 in the number will, but not a 3030 or 4040. The first half of the number is the number of spaces, the second half is the number of circuits. So a 2030 will have 20 spaces and can have 30 circuits, allowing 10 tandems (usually at the bottom). A 4040 will have 40 spaces for 40 circuits.

You can also look at the bus bars. If they're square and flat across the front edge (the end towards you), then it only accepts full-size breakers. If there's a V-notch in it, it will accept a tandem on either side.

I'm well aware of all of this. In fact I mentioned some of it in my post that you partially quoted.

I also know that I can get a tandem into any panel. :wink:

[Dennis Alwon]

Who inspects the inspector? ;)
Around here an inspector is not allowed to work in an area where his office does inspections.

[iaov]

I'm well aware of all of this. In fact I mentioned some of it in my post that you partially quoted.

I also know that I can get a tandem into any panel. :wink:Haven't found one that has stopped me either. Wasn't even aware it was an issue until reading this post.:smile:

[Dennis Alwon]

Haven't found one that has stopped me either. Wasn't even aware it was an issue until reading this post.:smile:

What brand are you using? I know you can get some of the old ITE twins in if you modify the breaker a bit but it ain't legal. :smile:

[Cow]

What brand are you using? I know you can get some of the old ITE twins in if you modify the breaker a bit but it ain't legal. :smile:

Siemens too.

[Power Tech]

They do make 2 different twin breakers for Square D and Murry etc. The $7 type has a rejection clip or shallow clip and can only be installed in a notched bussing. The $14 type has a deep clip and can be installed on the solid and notched bussing.

Terry
Power Tech

[frenchelectrican]

They do make 2 different twin breakers for Square D and Murry etc. The $7 type has a rejection clip or shallow clip and can only be installed in a notched bussing. The $14 type has a deep clip and can be installed on the solid and notched bussing.

Terry
Power Tech

Yeah they do and one of our members here have specal tool he can actally make a punch gimzo to used on the Sq QO series sooner or later this person will tell ya on this one.

Merci,Marc

[ivsenroute]

Who inspects the inspector? ;)


Whoever is the AHJ where I perform work.

In areas where there is no AHJ I hire an electrical inspector of my choosing.

I have yet to perform work where I inspect.