#12 to #14 Splice

[charlie b]

A have a project involving poke-through devices to serve floor receptacles from the room below. A complete statement of the problem would take up too much space. Short description: The EC has need of a butt splice (i.e., crimp) that can take a #12 wire on one side and a #14 on the other. He has 10/12 and he has 14/16, but no 12/14.

Does anyone know if such things exist?

[growler]

A have a project involving poke-through devices to serve floor receptacles from the room below. A complete statement of the problem would take up too much space. Short description: The EC has need of a butt splice (i.e., crimp) that can take a #12 wire on one side and a #14 on the other. He has 10/12 and he has 14/16, but no 12/14.

Does anyone know if such things exist?

If he is making a splice then he needs a box and if there is a box then he can use wire nuts.

What I'm trying to say is if the wire is to short then splice #12 to #12 inside the box and then wire nut to the #14. I wouldn't use any flying splice (outside the box ).

[mdshunk]

Buchannan crimp sleeves with the rubber Buchannan insulator.

I'm not sure there's a 12 to 14 butt splice made, other than the Wiremold W-30's.

[iwire]

I heard a rumor that 14 AWG stranded stripped about .75" and folded over on itself fits a 10-12 crimp perfectly. ;)

[charlie b]

If he is making a splice then he needs a box and if there is a box then he can use wire nuts.
It’s not that easy, Dale. There is no room for wire nuts. I guess I need to tell more of the story.

There is a molded, plastic case that houses four 20 amp receptacles (and some data connections). This will be installed on the floor of a conference room, just under the table. There is a short section (1.5 inches or so) of #14 wire welded (yes, I said welded) to each of the connection points on the receptacles. The weld points are encased within the plastic, and are therefore not accessible to the installer.

The manufacturer then connected a longer piece (about 18 inches) of #14 wire to each of the 1.5 inch wires. These 18 inch pieces are the pigtails to which incoming wires are intended to be connected. There is a short section of conduit attached to the bottom of the plastic case, and the 18 inch wires are sticking out of the bottom of this conduit. The manufactured unit does not include a junction box at the bottom of this conduit.

In a sane world, the EC could just add a junction box at the bottom of this thing, and run from there to the breaker panel. But the bottom of this conduit will be located in the room below, within the two foot space between that room’s concrete ceiling and its “false ceiling” (a hard gypsum ceiling). The client does not want any access panels in the gypsum ceiling. So I can’t put a junction box at the bottom of the concrete ceiling (because the JB would not be accessible).

This component, the poke-through, is rated by the manufacturer at 20 amps. So I can disregard the fact that it has internal #14 wires. I want to run a set of #12 wires, and to use 20 amp breakers. To achieve that goal, I need to attach the #12 to one of the two #14 (i.e., to the 1.5 inch wire or to the 18 inch wire). If I attach to the 18 inch wire, then the splice would have to be in the conduit – not allowed.

The EC suggested cutting the connection between the 1.5 inch wires and the 18 inch wires. He could then attach the 1.5 inch wires to 20 foot wires, and run them (in flex) to a junction box in an area that doesn’t have hard ceilings. But that would entail splicing a #14 to a #12, and that brings me back to my original question.

(I told you it would be a long story. )

[charlie b]

I heard a rumor that 14 AWG stranded stripped about .75" and folded over on itself fits a 10-12 crimp perfectly. ;)
I also heard a rumor that you could fit a #12 into a #14 crimp, if you first cut away some of the strands of the #12. :wink:

[iwire]

I hear you.

But unless you want to have some custom crimps made you may have to change something.

If a mechanical connection could be used I suggest this..

http://www.idealindustries.com/media/img/products/wire_termination/product/barrier_strips.jpg

They can be cut into smaller segments and left floating in the box like a crimp or can be secured.

This (http://www.idealindustries.com/prodDetail.do?prodId=89-610&div=0&l1=terminal_blocks_strips) one handles 22 AWG to 10 AWG.

[Dennis Alwon]

I never really understood why a #14 wire would not work in a butt splice that was rated for #12. If you crimp it it seems it would work as well as a #12 in the same splice, although I realize it is not listed for that size wire.

[winnie]

Is there enough room to use a crimp splice (eg http://www.idealindustries.com/prodDetail.do?prodId=2006S ) and then fold the wires back, rather than using an inline connector?

-Jon

[benaround]

Charlie,

Do you have to use the recpts. that came with it ?

[tkb]

How about these?

http://www.mcmaster.com/nav/enter.asp?pagenum=728 (http://www.mcmaster.com/nav/enter.asp?pagenum=728)

[360Youth]

Sometimes it just depends on the crimp. I have a tray full of the blue 14/16 that will fit my #12 THHN perfectly and others that don't. :-? Some of the crimps I got at a supply house, some at an auto parts store. :roll:

[charlie b]

How about these? http://www.mcmaster.com/nav/enter.asp?pagenum=728 (http://www.mcmaster.com/nav/enter.asp?pagenum=728)

That looks like it might do the job nicely. Many thanks.

[charlie b]

Is there enough room to use a crimp splice http://www.idealindustries.com/prodDetail.do?prodId=2006S (http://www.idealindustries.com/prodDetail.do?prodId=2006S) and then fold the wires back, rather than using an inline connector?

That also looks like a possible option. Many thanks as well.

[charlie b]

Do you have to use the recpts. that came with it ?
The receptacles, the data outlets, the plastic case, and the conduit at the bottom are all integral parts of this poke-through. They cannot be separated from each other, without destroying the device.