Coolest way to do this??

[jjhoward]

What is the coolest way to get wire through all those damn beams when installing old work HHs?
Lving space above the room, finished basement below.
So we usualy cut holes in the ceiling between the beams and then drill holes and pull wires.
Any magic to minimize the ceiling cutting?

Thanks!

[peter d]

Wiremold?

There is really no easy way to do this without cutting holes. You can make one hole and use a long flex bit to drill through several joists, but I don't reccomend this. I was on a job where someone took out a 4/0-4 SER cable doing this.

[jjhoward]

Yup, been there, not quite done that but we have hit a pipe with those long bits, gone through the floor upstairs and once went through a roof.
We have retired those bits.:)

[brantmacga]

Wiremold?

I was on a job where someone took out a 4/0-4 SER cable doing this.

ouch! i heard about a guy taking out the service cable a couple of weeks ago while cutting a floor out w/ a 9" sawzall blade.

[electricman2]

ouch! i heard about a guy taking out the service cable a couple of weeks ago while cutting a floor out w/ a 9" sawzall blade.
I bet it wasn't 9" when it was over.:rolleyes:

[mdshunk]

I have pretty good luck with the flex bits. You do have to use your mind's eye as you drill. The placement tool helps a ton. I generally cut all my circles for the cans first, then look around in each one to scope out my plan. Sometimes there's already holes in the joists you can utilize from other work. Get you one of these: http://www.ridgid.com/Tools/SeeSnake-micro

[RayS]

I'll second the see-snake idea. Grainger just had them clearanced out....

[mdshunk]

The trick to the flex bits is to get started straight to begin with. The holes will go "uphill" as you drill in a ceiling, so start low. Wag the bit back and fourth to get an idea of the total height you have available, and start on the low side, as straight as you can. I sometimes drill from both directions, and poke a fish stick in from both ways and hook them in the middle. I put the hook on one, and a loop on the other.

Toss a couple 2-1/2" snap-in bushings up in the ceiling cavity too, for no special reason.

[Buck Parrish]

I guess you know when you first draw your six inch round hole for the renovation light. Drill or poke a small hole in the center. Make a L shape out of a piece of wire, with the small part of the L about 3 1/2 inch. Insert the small part in the center hole then turn. This way at least you wont hit a beam on your light hole cuts.
I love to see them recessed speakers they make great access.

[peter d]

Toss a couple 2-1/2" snap-in bushings up in the ceiling cavity too, for no special reason.

I have a truckload of them coming straight from Arlington - special delivery. How many do you want?

[jjhoward]

How much for one of those see snake thingies?

[electricalperson]

when i do old work in celings i usually try to find a closet close by to make the hole in the celing in. then i fish from the celing to the basement and over to where they want the switch. you never see any holes when im finished unless you open the closet :)

[480sparky]

$200.

You can also use one of these to aim your flex bit:

http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc172/480sparky/712P.jpg

[jjhoward]

The flex bit is a good approach but sometimes there is just too many things in the ceiling to use that flex bit.
HWBB lines
Water line
Wiring
Gas lines

Usually there aren't any good clues to let you know these things are there.
I guess that see snake tool could let us know if the bay is clear with only making a small hole.

[jjhoward]

Yes, we have used that flex bit holding/aiming tool. It does help.

That see snake tool is only $200. Sounds like a winner to me!

[bikeindy]

My crew has done 56 remod cans in Jan and we do many. MD has all the answers on this we do all that he is talking about it takes time to "know" where things are and might be but you can get good and make a lot of happy customers.

[jjhoward]

MD always has the answers!:)
I think he must be cheating:)

[electricalperson]

sometimes i really enjoy old work. takes skill

[480sparky]

sometimes i really enjoy old work. takes skill

What's really fun is pulling off a complicated remodel and not damaging any finished walls/ceilings/floors and know you still did it right.

[macmikeman]

I have another method I use when the spacing between the recess cans is so far apart, I am not about to try flexibit drilling that far. Most of the 2 story houses I run into are newer, unlike what you guys in the East encounter. The second floor rooms usually have carpet on the floor, and the flooring is mostly plywood. I'll pull up the carpet, take a skill saw set on an inside 45 bevel and set for the thickness of the plywood. I cut a channel out about 3" wide, pull up the piece and save it for re-installation. Once I have drilled out the joist from above I can simply route the wiring, and then screw down the wood piece again. It will sink slightly now due to the thickness of the saw blade, but usually the carpet pad makes this unnoticeable. I don't carry em around with me in my truck regularly, but I have a couple of carpet stretchers. I put the carpet back and bingo bango done.

[220/221]

We gave up on the flex bits years ago. It's just drywall. Cut and patch it wherever necessary.

[haskinsr]

I guess you know when you first draw your six inch round hole for the renovation light. Drill or poke a small hole in the center. Make a L shape out of a piece of wire, with the small part of the L about 3 1/2 inch. Insert the small part in the center hole then turn. This way at least you wont hit a beam on your light hole cuts.
I love to see them recessed speakers they make great access.

I do the same thing with an offset rotary type screwdriver.

http://images.lowes.com/product/converted/092644/092644851766md.jpg

[macmikeman]

We gave up on the flex bits years ago. It's just drywall. Cut and patch it wherever necessary.

Do they not spray texture much in your area? Matching sprayed texture is out of my personal league.

[e57]

Do they not spray texture much in your area? Matching sprayed texture is out of my personal league.

Know any one who's league it is in - maybe they need some work.... :wink:

I used to have a rocker/painter/faux finisher follow me around for a while until he had personal issues take his life over.... Other than that it worked well for the both of us.

Flex bits can easily make a small job a big repair IMO. Too bad you can't train rats to do it.....

[RayS]

How much for one of those see snake thingies?
looks like it's $231 now

http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/items/1MAJ2

[TwinCitySparky]

$200.

You can also use one of these to aim your flex bit:

http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc172/480sparky/712P.jpg

I love it when they wont show the model how to hold the tool...

Yup! Looks good - You drilled right thru the siding... :grin: :D

[220/221]

Do they not spray texture much in your area?

Typically we only do a rough patch. Finish patch and paint is excluded.

MOST of the time there is other renovation going on and their drywall/paint guy takes care of it. If not we give them the name of someone who will make it pretty again.

Ocaisionally, if it's a small patch I will do my best to finish it.

[satcom]

Know any one who's league it is in - maybe they need some work.... :wink:

I used to have a rocker/painter/faux finisher follow me around for a while until he had personal issues take his life over.... Other than that it worked well for the both of us.

Flex bits can easily make a small job a big repair IMO. Too bad you can't train rats to do it.....

We have customers tell us they call to have patch work done and everyone wanted from $200 to $275, for a small patch, were in the wrong business.

[aline]

We have customers tell us they call to have patch work done and everyone wanted from $200 to $275, for a small patch, were in the wrong business.
We're not in the wrong business. We just don't place a high enough value on our services and charge enough. :)

Electricians would go out and do this for an $80 service call or for free in hopes of getting more work in the future.

If every electrician charged $200 for a service call I believe people would pay it just like they pay over $3 a gallon for gas.

[j_erickson]

Almost everywhere around here the ceilings are "strapped" or "furred". So you can fish across an entire ceiling generally without obstruction.

[mdshunk]

Almost everywhere around here the ceilings are "strapped" or "furred". So you can fish across an entire ceiling generally without obstruction.
That's awesome. We hardly ever run into that here. That's usually a framing detail reserved for blueboard jobs, from what I've seen.