Save 25% on your electric

[Rewire]

I was just called by a company promoting a device you can install to save on your electric bill.I know some discussion has been made on these but I thought it strange that they mentioned Mike Holt by name and stated he had to retract an article he had written.I cant find anything on the site about this and may not know where to look.The are holding a seminar in a few weeks to promote the product and I have an invite.I want to go armed with the most up to date info so please help.

[mdshunk]

Yeah, do a search here for "power save" and power factor correction. A bunch of snake oil.

[cowboyjwc]

I don't have to worry about my electric bill. I have a Nigerian prince wiring several million dollars to my bank account as I type. :D

[Lxnxjxhx]

Same here, but I'm supposed to act as "a stand-in beneficiary" for some woman who's dying.
Not today, I'm not. . .

[electricguy]

I don't have to worry about my electric bill. I have a Nigerian prince wiring several million dollars to my bank account as I type. :D

Wow be our lucky day I won a lottery :D

"YOU 'VE WON.

Your email have won ($1,500,000.00) Dollars in DE CASINO
ONLINE INT S.L
Euro milliones.Esp.Forfurther development for
Clarification and
procedure please Contact the paying bank"

[cschmid]

oh man you guys get all the lucky ones all I get is come visit me at my web site..Oh yea and dear brother in christ..

[drbond24]

There are a few threads on the subject in this forum; just search for the phrases mdshunk mentioned. You can go to the website for Power Save (just google search it) to get all of their propoganda.

Not sure what you're looking for, but the basic idea is that they claim that by correcting your power factor they will save you money on your power bill. How much they can help your power factor is arguable, but unless you are being penalized by your POCO for your power factor, correcting it will not save you money. Even if the box did what they said, your bill will not be less since the POCO doesn't care what the power factor of your house is. Only larger facilities like the industrial plant I work in have to worry about their power factor. We correct with capacitors so we don't have to pay extra on our bill.

[Rewire]

There are a few threads on the subject in this forum; just search for the phrases mdshunk mentioned. You can go to the website for Power Save (just google search it) to get all of their propoganda.

Not sure what you're looking for, but the basic idea is that they claim that by correcting your power factor they will save you money on your power bill. How much they can help your power factor is arguable, but unless you are being penalized by your POCO for your power factor, correcting it will not save you money. Even if the box did what they said, your bill will not be less since the POCO doesn't care what the power factor of your house is. Only larger facilities like the industrial plant I work in have to worry about their power factor. We correct with capacitors so we don't have to pay extra on our bill.
What I was looking for was the reference to Mike holt and an article he suposedly retracted,I do enjoy the jocularity of the posters so far I am making a serious inquiry so that I can be armed with facts and not just opinion.

[coulter]

Can you give us the name of the company? Maybe be easier to find the article.

If this is a variation on the PowerSaver, I really hope Mike did not give any retraction. Everything I've seen from outfits like that, they are lying.

http://forums.mikeholt.com/showthread.php?t=96248

http://forums.mikeholt.com/showthread.php?t=91211

There is a reference to a Aug 23, 2007 Mike newsletter - haven't read it yet.

edit added a link, fixed one of the spelling errors

carl

[mdshunk]

http://www.mikeholt.com/newsletters.php?action=display&letterID=406

[coulter]

http://mikeholt.com/newsletters.php?action=display&letterID=434

Here is the Aug 23,2007 newsletter. I don't see any retraction - maybe there is another one.

Check this link. Print out the paper attached to the link. It's pretty informative.

Try not to be surprised if you get yelled down when you show it to them. Liars really don't have anywhere to go except to get louder and repitive.

carl

[Lxnxjxhx]

Doesn't your electric meter read watts and not VAs, if if your PF is not at 0?

[coulter]

Marc's link is really interesting.

Be sure to read Douglas Paul's comments. It's rare I seen such a collection of half-truths. One might consider the statements "TRWWTHs:rolleyes:

I would consider his argument similar to:
"Installing this device in a residential setting can not save any money."

(DP response) ""Oh yes it will, if one measures the indirect savings and installs in a industrial setting."

Just curious, Does an "indirect saving" put money in one's pocket?

carl

[coulter]

Doesn't your electric meter read watts and not VAs, if if your PF is not at 0?
Not sure I understand. Residential kwh meters read watts - even if your pf is 0.

carl

[Rewire]

The people who called me are a distributor for KVAR energy systems.I think they ate looking for electricians to front for them.

[mdshunk]

The people who called me are a distributor for KVAR energy systems.I think they ate looking for electricians to front for them.
That must be a common tactic. I've gotten at least one similar call from another company. I ended up on the list of installers for yet anyther such company, and I've ne'er had contact with a soul from that outfit.

[coulter]

http://www.saveenergyllc.com/Residential.html

Is this the device? Only thing I could see even close. It's marketed by several outfits.

I see this particular outfit is real careful about how they shroud their lies - yep they are liars.

carl

[dhducati]

Doesn't your electric meter read watts and not VAs, if if your PF is not at 0?

Yes, it reads watts (watt hours) not VA. A customer asked me about one of these devices a few months back. Being skeptical and curious I wanted to see how they were claiming to save up to 25%, so I searched online and found a test report for one of these power saving devices that was supposedly done by an independent lab for the maker of the device. I was refreshed to find that the data in the report made sense, even if it wasn't presented very scientifically. The data showed that the power (watts) was unchanged or slightly higher when the device was connected, and that the VA was a little lower in some cases. The written conclusions, however, conveniently ignored the relevant data in the report. :mad:

The report said nothing of resistive losses in the house wiring, which is the only thing I could see that could conceivably be a very small benefit of PF correction for the home owner at the residential level. But this really works against the device because any minor saving in resistive losses in the circuit wiring when an appliance motor was operating would be more than outweighed by the increased resistive losses from the larger current flowing due the over-corrected (negative) PF when the appliance motor was not operating.

Dave

[Lxnxjxhx]

Watthours and PF = 1, not 0, for resistive. Two mistakes in one sentence!
I used to know this stuff.

[robbietan]

http://www.saveenergyllc.com/Residential.html

Is this the device? Only thing I could see even close. It's marketed by several outfits.

I see this particular outfit is real careful about how they shroud their lies - yep they are liars.

carl


just been to the website.

... will reduce demand at the meter by reducing lost and wasted power ???

even Harry Potter can't do this.....