Poco Requirements vs NEC Requirements

[radiopet]

(E) Phase Arrangement. The phase arrangement on
3-phase buses shall be A, B, C from front to back, top to
bottom, or left to right, as viewed from the front of the
switchboard or panelboard. The B phase shall be that phase
having the higher voltage to ground on 3-phase, 4-wire,
delta-connected systems. Other busbar arrangements shall
be permitted for additions to existing installations and shall
be marked.

Where does this apply to meter enclosures provided by the POCO? That is why it is very important the electrical contractor knows this and when the NEC picks it up, that it lands in the center termination per the NEC.

 

[LarryFine]

Sounds like a violation to me.

Your landing C phase in B position.

Well, as the majority have agreed, it's all the rage.

 

[RonPecinaJr]

I've come to the conclusion that 408.3 (E) permits the high leg C phase to terminate in a B phase terminal when the panel is separate from the metering equipment. The exception is for when the meter and panel are one in the same single enclosure.

 

[brantmacga]

. . . We've changed policy since, it's now BYO through the meter to BOY in the panel everytime regardless of high leg or not. This way there are no screwups.

I work w/ a couple of poco's that will not give you a hookup if you identify a conductor orange on what is supposed to be a wye supplied service.

 

[hillbilly1]

That's what we do too. We used to run it BOY all the way through the meterbase to the panel unless we knew it was high leg. Every once in a while though, we'd have a hiccup and mistaked wye for high leg and had to move it over in the meterbase. We've changed policy since, it's now BYO through the meter to BOY in the panel everytime regardless of high leg or not. This way there are no screwups.

Down here Brown,Orange,Yellow is used for 480 three phase wye systems, so it stays the same from the meter through the entire service. Only on Delta's (which are mostly 120/240 down here)(Black,Orange,Blue) does it move from "C" in the meter to "B" in the panel or service.

 

[LarryFine]

I work w/ a couple of poco's that will not give you a hookup if you identify a conductor orange on what is supposed to be a wye supplied service.

They can't tell the difference between brown/orange/yellow and black/orange/blue?

 

[brantmacga]

They can't tell the difference between brown/orange/yellow and black/orange/blue?

they do it because they can.


i have a sheet somewhere of all their color requirements somewhere. one day i'll find it and share. it was pretty wild stuff. i remember though you can't have any unidentified colors; as in, just a black cable is not allowed, ever. 240v single phase has to be red/white/blue. something about the tape could come off and leave you with two blacks, and then they wouldn't know which is which.

 

[LarryFine]

I see the POCO use red, yellow, and blue a lot. They add their colors to ours.

 

[iwire]

In my area, the POCO makes the connections within the meter and they tell the contractor where to make the connections.

Not here.:smile:

 

[radiopet]

Not here.:smile:

lol...well I live in a "Commonwealth State " so we get told what to do all the time. I work for a local government and I am ALWAYS getting told what to do from political powers higher than my own office so.....I smile, count the days to retirement and long for the weekends where I travel and spew my own code beliefs only do come back on monday and snap back to local governmental reality.

 

[RonPecinaJr]

they do it because they can.


i have a sheet somewhere of all their color requirements somewhere. one day i'll find it and share. it was pretty wild stuff. i remember though you can't have any unidentified colors; as in, just a black cable is not allowed, ever. 240v single phase has to be red/white/blue. something about the tape could come off and leave you with two blacks, and then they wouldn't know which is which.

Red, white, and blue for 3-wire single phase? The red on single phase would never fly here. Apparently the poco guys would get "confused" is what I was told by one of the PS guys years ago. Why they might get confused is beyond me, but I do understand the reasoning for it even though it is a single phase voltage. You would think the poco guys would realize it is impossible to get three phases from a single transformer, but I digress. I do black, white, blue so each conductor is identified in the event that one of them becomes problem later on it can be readily identified.

 

[LarryFine]

I work for a local government and I am ALWAYS getting told what to do from political powers higher than my own office so.....

Paul, I can't tell you what to do, but if you ever get lost, I'd be happy to tell you where to go. :grin:

 

[LarryFine]

Red, white, and blue for 3-wire single phase? The red on single phase would never fly here.

How unAmerican! Even Knopp phase-rotation testers use red, white and blue.

Besides, haven't they looked inside 3-conductor cable before?

 

[RonPecinaJr]

How unAmerican! Even Knopp phase-rotation testers use red, white and blue.

Besides, haven't they looked inside 3-conductor cable before?

Even SE cable has a red line along the insulation to identify it as separate from the black. I never used to do this until I worked with an electrician that did identify 3-wire single phase SEC's. He did them in blue but one day I must have been unprepared for the job and used red instead of the blue. I'm pretty sure it was the utility side of an underground service and POCO engineer was there to inspect the depth of conduit before energizing it the next day. he saw me taping one of the conductors red and told me to not to do it.