Article 312.8

[chevyx92]

Inspector 404.3(B) and says we can not have a nipple between our two section panelboards. I gave him a call and cited 312.8 and said I feel it's ok. He then tells me that section is for Cabinets, Cutout Boxes and Meter Socket Enclosures. He said that panelboards don't fall under this section. I argued that a panelboard meets the definition of a "Cabinet". He then saw my point and agreed that a panelboard would fall in this category. He said he would allow the nipple if I comply with 1 of 2 conditions. Either provide him with literature from the panelboard manufacturer stating its ok to use that panel for a raceway or give him a calculation showing I'm not over my fill in the panel. Does anybody else think he's going a bit far with his interpretation and conditions? This was the chief electrical inspector I spoke to.

 

[infinity]

It's nearly impossible to exceed the fill limitations of that section. IMO the guy is asking for something that he shouldn't be.

 

[electricmanscott]

Not sure if he is a jerk but he's certainly acting like one.

 

[iwire]

I gave him a call and cited 312.8 and said I feel it's ok. He then tells me that section is for Cabinets, Cutout Boxes and Meter Socket Enclosures. He said that panel boards don't fall under this section.

A well trained person. :roll:

Either provide him with literature from the panelboard manufacturer stating its ok to use that panel for a raceway or give him a calculation showing I'm not over my fill in the panel. Does anybody else think he's going a bit far with his interpretation and conditions?

Show him the calculation, I think he entitled to ask for that.

If I recall when I did one for the gutter space of a normal residential panel it was well over 200 #12s.

 

[masterinbama]

If I recall when I did one for the gutter space of a normal residential panel it was well over 200 #12s.

Did you cram them in there just to prove you could?

I think I opened that panel the other day.

 

[iwire]

Did you cram them in there just to prove you could?

I think I opened that panel the other day.

:grin: :grin:

 

[chevyx92]

I don't have an illustrated NEC handbook but was wondering if they had anything on this article in there?

 

[M. D.]

Perhaps you could give him a little quiz

http://ecmweb.com/nec/code_quiz_082404/

A 200A rated panelboard (load center) has wiring space on each side that measures 4 inches wide by 4 inches deep. The total length of the wiring space on each side is 36 inches. Three individual splices that each consists of two 4/0 AWG THHN/THWN insulated conductors are connected by split-bolt connectors are located on one side of the panelboard in the wiring space. Each split bolt connector is about 1.5625 square inches (2 cubic inches). Does the NEC permit these splices in the wiring space area of a panelboard? If they are, do they comply with the NEC requirements for splices in enclosures?

A) Yes, No
B) Yes, Yes
C) No, No
D) No, Yes

 

[iwire]

Perhaps you could give him a little quiz

http://ecmweb.com/nec/code_quiz_082404/

You never fail to bring great references to us.

Thanks. :smile:

 

[M. D.]

You never fail to bring great references to us.

Thanks. :smile:

You're welcome and here is one for the O.P.'s question on raceway

Q. Can I pass conductors from one panel through another panel? If so, what are the restrictions?

Service conductors and other feeder conductors are permitted in the same enclosure [230.70].


A. Yes, cabinets, cutout boxes, and meter socket enclosures can be used as a raceway for conductors that feed through if the conductors do not fill the wiring space at any cross section to more than 40% [312.8], as shown in the Figure.

Service conductors and other conductors are permitted to be installed in the same enclosure [230.7]. Splices and taps can be installed in cabinets, cutout boxes, or meter socket enclosures if the splices or taps do not fill the wiring space at any cross section to more than 75% [312.8].

 

[M. D.]

If a #12 thhn has a in.sq area of 0.0133 and let's say a 4x4 wire space then it would take 450 #12s to equal 40% fill ?

0.0133 x 450 = 5.985

4 x 4 = 16

16 x .40 = 6.4

 

[infinity]

If a #12 thhn has a in.sq area of 0.0133 and let's say a 4x4 wire space then it would take 450 #12s to equal 40% fill ?

Your calculation solidifies my opinion in post #2. :smile:

 

[M. D.]

I would love to see his face when "chevey" does the calculation ,..

" Well lets see ,... yup ,.. just as I thought I can install 300 more # 12's and here is the math to prove it "