Hampton bay ceiling fan light trouble

[ashtrak]

Hey Guys:
I hung a ceiling fan for a customer last night and can't get the flourescent light to light
I've got 118.5 volts on the primary of the ballast and 28.5 volts on the secondary, the bulb is 30 watt circular.I put a volt meter on the primary and can watch the voltage when I switch the remote.So I know the remote is working.However when I do the on off switching for the light and my meter is on the primary wires I see a voltage drop,down to like 103 slowly.If the meter is on the secondary and I do switching it drops slowly from 28.8. (Hampton Bay model)I dont know what the secondary voltage should be and can't seem to find any tech support without wadeing through all the 9 to $15 dollar answer men.

Appreciate any help or a real hampton bay tech #

Thanks,
Dan

 

[mcclary's electrical]

Are you checking hot to neutral and getting 103? I don't like the sound of that, but I've seen a similar problem in new fans before. I've found the connectors crimped on between the light kit and fan were crimped on insulation. Restrip and crimp and in worked fine. I'm not doubting your 103 measurement, but I am wondering how you measured it.

 

[K8MHZ]

I believe what you are saying is that the remote controller in the fan is only supplying 103 volts to the light transformer. If you are sure you have a 120 volt transformer a quick test would be to bypass the remote module and connect the light transformer directly to 120 volts. If the light comes on I would suspect that the controller is flawed and is creating a voltage drop.

 

[ichimo23]

I install a lot of fans purchased at big box stores. I find about 1 in 20 to be defective out of the box. Bad motors, bad crimps, loose connections. Luckily, there is a HD about every 5 square miles in the area that I work; and they have a liberal return policy. Still chaffes me that I lose at least an hour to troubleshooting, repacking and driving to the store...

 

[satcom]

I install a lot of fans purchased at big box stores. I find about 1 in 20 to be defective out of the box. Bad motors, bad crimps, loose connections. Luckily, there is a HD about every 5 square miles in the area that I work; and they have a liberal return policy. Still chaffes me that I lose at least an hour to troubleshooting, repacking and driving to the store...

How do you loose time or money if you din't supply the fan, the trouble shooting get billed to the customer.

 

[ichimo23]

on a simple fan install, i charge a flat rate based on the situation (if I have to pull a new switch leg, if there is attic access etc). That's how I lose....On those rare occasions when I do a fan install at my hourly rate, I split the difference with the customer as a courtesy. Being a swell guy tends to lead to more referrals, and more than makes up for that lost hour here or there.

 

[satcom]

on a simple fan install, i charge a flat rate based on the situation (if I have to pull a new switch leg, if there is attic access etc). That's how I lose....On those rare occasions when I do a fan install at my hourly rate, I split the difference with the customer as a courtesy. Being a swell guy tends to lead to more referrals, and more than makes up for that lost hour here or there.

Our flat rate prices are different for every condition, each additional task increases the flat rate cost, so there is no way to loose time of money on flat rate, provided your flat rates include all the conditions for each job.

 

[celtic]

on a simple fan install, i charge a flat rate based on the situation (if I have to pull a new switch leg, if there is attic access etc). That's how I lose....

Our flat rate prices are different for every condition, each additional task increases the flat rate cost, so there is no way to loose time of money on flat rate, provided your flat rates include all the conditions for each job.

I'm with satcom here.

If you are losing due to your flat rate parameters ~ change them to a winning combination.

 

[Kdog76]

If that remote you are using is any sort of a dimmer for the light kit on the fan- it will not work with a compact florescent bulb. This 30 watt circular bulb- I've seen the circular bulbs before - but never on a ceiling fan light. Are you sure it's not a compact florescent? Compact florescent bulbs in general cannot be dimmed unless you match the dimmer to the type of bulb you are using. Also, in my experience most remote controls for ceiling fans work as dimmers for the bulbs. If that is the case, try sticking an incandescent bulb in there.
However, maybe it is a circular florescent bulb...Sounds like that maybe it is, but I have never put one in that had that kind of a light kit on it... Could you clarify that kind of bulb it is?
I do know that a standard dimmer will NOT work on a florescent bulb of ANY kind. It has to be a special dimmer.

 

[danickstr]

while a part of me admires the cold and savvy businessmen here who figure out a way to backcharge their customers for every contingency, I find it hard to believe that they don't occasionally "eat it" for the customer, in the name of building a good relationship.

 

[satcom]

while a part of me admires the cold and savvy businessmen here who figure out a way to backcharge their customers for every contingency, I find it hard to believe that they don't occasionally "eat it" for the customer, in the name of building a good relationship.

Yes don't backcharge that is a bad practice, when you flat rate you have all your charges known to the customer up front before you start the work. Flat Rate pricing has been around for many years, and still you will find some that don't understand how to apply it, it is not a price found on a sheet in a book, it is a price assembled when you arrive at the site and looked at the tasks involved in preforming the required work. Flat Rate is a process not a listed price. Once the process of estimating on site is mastered, you can Flat Rate with success, and plenty of happy customers.

 

[ichimo23]

My point exactly. I do flat rate pricing on fan installs based on what the job 'seems' to entail when I arrive. When an unforseen circumstance arises (like a defective fan) the customer REALLY appreciates not getting back charged for something out of everyone's control. Situations like this arise so infrequently that 'eating' an hour here or there is offset many times over by the good will (and referrals) generated.

 

[growler]

My point exactly. I do flat rate pricing on fan installs based on what the job 'seems' to entail when I arrive. When an unforseen circumstance arises (like a defective fan) the customer REALLY appreciates not getting back charged for something out of everyone's control. Situations like this arise so infrequently that 'eating' an hour here or there is offset many times over by the good will (and referrals) generated.

ichimo your profile says that you are an apprentice electrician. Are you running a side business installing fans or is this a policy that's used during normal working hours on the boss's time?

 

[satcom]

When an unforseen circumstance arises (like a defective fan) the customer REALLY appreciates not getting back charged for something out of everyone's control. Situations like this arise so infrequently that 'eating' an hour here or there is offset many times over by the good will (and referrals) generated.

I don't know your experience, but when the customer has a defective device he purchased, it is his burden to pay for the cost of replacement and labor, these situations are not infrequent, they are a very common situation in the service business, and if you tried to eat these expenses you would not have a business, good will is something that should not cause you any loss of time or money, and referrals are a result of good general business practices, not cutting breaks for customers, cutting your rate, in the long term, will only reduce your self worth, and instill a lack of your value with the customer.

 

[MarkyMarkNC]

If his flat rate price already takes into account the one in twenty times there is a faulty fan, then he is not losing money.

To me, fan installation is a foot in the door type job anyway. Half the time the customer will remember some other project they need done while you are there. Often the job results in several referrals to friends / relatives / co-workers. I have enough built into my fan install price to give the customer a bit of lee-way as well.

 

[satcom]

Some intresting information for the Fans with Lights. http://www.americanlightingassoc.com/members/files/CeilingFanInfo_9-08.pdf

 

[Ohmy]

How do you loose time or money if you din't supply the fan, the trouble shooting get billed to the customer.

How does that work? First, you install a fan then its light does not come on when you hit the switch and then you say "hey customer, the fan I installed does not work, I need to charge you for troubleshooting why the fan I justed installed does not work." OR you troubleshoot it and say to the customer "hey, this fan I installed is defective so it took me longer to install...now you owe me additional money on top of the guaranteed flat fee I gave you 30 minutes ago."

To the OP florescent lights on fans and remotes don't mix even when the remote and the fan come in the same box. Even if you get the light to come on it will flicker. We strongly recondmend using incandescent lights or no remotes to our customers. Maybe in the future the ballast and remotes will get better but right now the consumer grade stuff that customers are getting at HD and Lowes causes problems.

 

[satcom]

How does that work? First, you install a fan then its light does not come on when you hit the switch and then you say "hey customer, the fan I installed does not work, I need to charge you for troubleshooting why the fan I justed installed does not work." OR you troubleshoot it and say to the customer "hey, this fan I installed is defective so it took me longer to install...now you owe me additional money on top of the guaranteed flat fee I gave you 30 minutes ago."

When he finished the install per instructions, and the unit is not working, he should have language in his flat rate work order that explaines the remedy for customer supplied material, the remedy usually is he would remove the fan or light and come back to reinstall the replacement fan at additional charges. When you give Flat Rate prices, you need to have a signed acceptance, and the customer needs to understand all the terms, Flat Rate Pricing is a Contract. I am sure he was not prepared to do Flat Rate Work, my bet is he did not have a signed agreement, with the terms before he started the work.

 

[Ohmy]

When he finished the install per instructions, and the unit is not working, he should have language in his flat rate work order that explaines the remedy for customer supplied material, the remedy usually is he would remove the fan or light and come back to reinstall the replacement fan at additional charges. When you give Flat Rate prices, you need to have a signed acceptance, and the customer needs to understand all the terms, Flat Rate Pricing is a Contract. I am sure he was not prepared to do Flat Rate Work, my bet is he did not have a signed agreement, with the terms before he started the work.

Sure, the OP may have issues but I am more curious about your statement that you don't lose money on jobs where the fan is defective. Not in negative way but because I like to avoid losing money also.

What I am understanding is you recommend every time you hang a fan to say "hey, you supplied this fan and I am going to hang it. If it does not work after I install it. You will have to pay me to figure out why it does not work. please sign here." Then if you put up a fan and the light does not work and you say "hey, the light on the fan I just installed for you does not work, you will need to pay me additional X to figure out why the fan I just hung does not work."

I am not picking at you, I just am really honestly curious to see if that is what you actually do.

 

[satcom]

Sure, the OP may have issues but I am more curious about your statement that you don't lose money on jobs where the fan is defective. Not in negative way but because I like to avoid losing money also.

What I am understanding is you recommend every time you hang a fan to say "hey, you supplied this fan and I am going to hang it. If it does not work after I install it. You will have to pay me to figure out why it does not work. please sign here." Then if you put up a fan and the light does not work and you say "hey, the light on the fan I just installed for you does not work, you will need to pay me additional X to figure out why the fan I just hung does not work."

I am not picking at you, I just am really honestly curious to see if that is what you actually do.

Why would you trouble it, you din't supply it, you just need to be pair for you time to take down and put the replacement the owner gets back up reinstall.

You don't have to explain anything to the customer, he decided to buy and supply the fan, if you supplied the fan then it is all on you.