UL needed or not?

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cman4

Member
Location
eastern shore,md.
Hi all,new to posting but have been a "lurker" for a while.I have a question in regards to homemade lamps.Have a friend who is making lamps and trying to sell them.He has no UL listing for his product,heck he's not even an electrician.My advice to him is to research his "buisiness" venture a little more but my advice has fallen on deaf ears so to say.Any input on needing a UL & liability would be greatly appreciated.Sorry so long winded.Thanks
 
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jmellc

Senior Member
Location
Durham, NC
Occupation
Facility Maintenance Tech. Licensed Electrician
My opinion, for what it's worth.

1. A UL sticker is no guarantee of quality. A product with it often is a good product, but I've worked with a lot of junk tat carried UL stickers. things with ungrounded metal parts, ground screws that strip out, wiring boxes too crowded for the factory wiring, let alone your incoming circuit.

2. My state requires UL listing on all electrical products sold. Violation is a misdemeanor. I think several other states require that too. So, probably best to check with an attorney and/or local authorities before selling them on the market. Check with UL on cost of getting approved. It will be high, I am sure. My state also allows one to get listing with other labs. I think they run some cheaper. May be worth checking out with your local authorities.
 
H

hillbilly1

Senior Member
Location
North Georgia mountains
Occupation
Owner/electrical contractor
Homemade lamps! That brings back memories! My very first electrical project was making a lamp using cedar stock. I think I was in the fifth grade, doing it for a 4-H project. I think my mom still has that lamp somewhere.:)
 
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TrekkerLB

New member
Location
Lakeland, FL
Hi Folks,

I work for another Nationally Recognized Testing Lab or NRTL - ETL.
The listing of table lamps is not always required per say - the AHJ's (electrical inspectors) in your jurisdiction may want everything including plug in's to be listed by a NRTL.

One individual asked if you are using all UL listed/recognized(that's another topic) parts isn't it enough - unfortunately not. I have seen people take really good components and make really dangerous stuff out of it.

In the event your interested the standard that the lamps would be tested to is UL 153.

Just as an FYI - when an AHJ says UL - they really mean any NRTL(CSA, ETL, TUV, UL) it's like someone saying that they need a Q-Tip - a cotton swab is what they need, it does not need to be the Q-Tip brand.

Anyone have questions about labs, listings or field labeling I'll be happy to try to help!
Luis
 
L

luckyshadow

Senior Member
Location
Maryland
2008 NEC article 410.6 states all luminaires and lampholders shall be listed.

Definition of listed as per article 100 - is equipment ,materials,or services included in a list published by an organization that is acceptable to the AHJ.

So it is up to the local AHJ to decide on who's listing. I'll bet they require UL as it is the most widely published and known listing company.
When an AHJ wants something field evaluated or field listed they most likely want a NRTL.
NRTL's are listed on the OSHA.gov website.
Here is a link to NRTL's and their address's:

http://www.osha.gov/dts/otpca/nrtl/nrtllist.html
 
R

Russ Edwards

Member
Location
Crown Point, IN
Russ Edwards

Russ Edwards

I would be interested in finding out how to get approval through your company. Thanks Russ Edwards

TrekkerLB said:
Hi Folks,

I work for another Nationally Recognized Testing Lab or NRTL - ETL.
The listing of table lamps is not always required per say - the AHJ's (electrical inspectors) in your jurisdiction may want everything including plug in's to be listed by a NRTL.

One individual asked if you are using all UL listed/recognized(that's another topic) parts isn't it enough - unfortunately not. I have seen people take really good components and make really dangerous stuff out of it.

In the event your interested the standard that the lamps would be tested to is UL 153.

Just as an FYI - when an AHJ says UL - they really mean any NRTL(CSA, ETL, TUV, UL) it's like someone saying that they need a Q-Tip - a cotton swab is what they need, it does not need to be the Q-Tip brand.

Anyone have questions about labs, listings or field labeling I'll be happy to try to help!
Luis
Click to expand...
 
W

wireguru

Senior Member
kbsparky said:
Since we are dealing with cord-and-plug connected lamps here, I would think that this is beyond what the AHJ would be concerned with.
Click to expand...

not always. For example in Los Angeles its illegal to sell or rent anything that plugs in which is not listed.
 
kwired

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
people purchase listed items all the time and use them for a purpose which they are not listed for, if it is cord and plug connected and not part of a new installation that gets inspected, who is going to stop them?
 
P

petersonra

Senior Member
Location
Northern illinois
Occupation
engineer
If one were to take a Ul listed lampholder and make your own shade, is that a problem?

Its not like you can't buy a replacement lampshade, and I doubt they are UL listed.
 
W

Wha Who?

Member
If your friend decides to pursue UL Listing and the product is portable (table) lamps, you will need a copy of UL 153. You will find that indoor table lamps are relatively simple to construct to avoid temperature testing. The process of listing without testing requires that you have a UL file opened and may require a tested product in the file before you can qualify for an untested fixture Listing.

Call a UL office for more. They should not charge you for an initial consultation.

Regarding a previous poster's comments about Chinese fixtures, it was determined some years ago, I will guess around 15, that some Chinese electrical goods had counterfeited UL Listing labels. That is why you see UL hologram labels on Chinese electrical goods, not so easy to counterfeit.
 
G

gbr123

New member
Location
Garden Grove California
Third party certifiers

Third party certifiers

Does the ICC (international code council) have anything to do with certifiying third party certifiers for electrical? If not, is there a singular AHJ or entity which is authorized to issue third party certifications?:-?
 
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