To pick a fight or cave in?

[ishium 80439]

Situation: Doing a small remodel that included a service upgrade. The drop comes in from the back of the house and passes over about 8' of porch roof that is only about a 2/12 pitch- ie walkable. 230.24 (A) tells me I need 8' of clearance. However the local utility will not permit this install because than they would not be able to service the splices from a ladder (the mast would be too high if a ladder was placed against the house and there is no safe way to put a ladder against the mast). I have run into this several times before and the utility company wins effectively cancelling out that section of 230.

This is a jurisdiction I have not worked in before. The inspector told me I have to raise the mast to get 5' of clearance above the roof. He told me they won't require the 8', but wants to see 5'. "That's the way we've been doing it for the 13 years I've been here". I have looked and as far as I can tell there are no written exceptions in the town's code.

To change this out I would basically need to break down the service again, install a larger mast, scrap the wire that is already in place, reterminate etc. I don't have the money in the job to do this twice.

So here is the question: Do I suck it up and do it again or do I dig my heels in? If this were only a service upgrade I would definately be stubborn about it. The problem is we have several more inspections coming with this inspector on the interior wiring we are doing. We all know how this works and this guy could make things very difficult for me on the rough and final.

So, what do you think?

 

[iwire]

Situation: Doing a small remodel that included a service upgrade. The drop comes in from the back of the house and passes over about 8' of porch roof that is only about a 2/12 pitch- ie walkable. 230.24 (A) tells me I need 8' of clearance.

Nothing in the NEC, including 230.24 applies to utility owned conductors. See 90.2(B)(5)(a).

As long as the utility is satisfied you should be allowed to continue.

 

[ishium 80439]

Excellent point. I hadn't even considered that.

 

[growler]

The drop comes in from the back of the house and passes over about 8' of porch roof that is only about a 2/12 pitch- ie walkable.

First thing I would do is double check the roof pitch and see if it's not more like 4/12. A 4/12 is still easy to walk on but that's where exception #2 starts to kick in and allow a 3 ft clearance.

On the bright side you don't see many roofs with a pitch of less than 4 " in 12" in this part of the country.

 

[charlietuna]

Why are you worried about future inspections -- if the job is installed to code what can the inspector say---seems like your looking for problems. Both the power company and the inspector are trying to cover their butts. To make everyone happy your gonna have to relocate the service mast to the edge of the porch. Is the porch part of the remodel, or was it there before you started the job? If it was existing, i would pass the problem to the homeowner...

 

[Jim W in Tampa]

Are both the inspectr and poco happy at 5 feet ? If yes problem solved.
You can not win fight with POCO don't even try.

 

[B4T]

The POCO here allows us to tie in an existing service when walking on a roof becomes an issue.

Someone sued the POCO a few years back, blaming them for a roof leak that developed after a service was tied it.

They will only tie in a service from a ladder or bucket truck depending on job conditions.

Maybe ask them if you could do final connections.

 

[One-eyed Jack]

Are both the inspectr and poco happy at 5 feet ? If yes problem solved.
You can not win fight with POCO don't even try.

Go with what Jim says. It sounds like the POCO and Coce Enforcement have reached a compromise for these rare drops that go over 6 ft across the roof.

 

[220/221]

Here, the NEC is moot with regard to POCO wiring. POCO is usually a bit forgiving with the 8' clearance rule.

POCO won't make splices above 6' over a rooftop.

 

[c2500]

What is the roofing material? If it is shingles..be they architectual or 3 tab, the rood is likely a 3 or 4 /12.

c2500

 

[macmikeman]

Just so you know, many poco's nowadays are under the NESC and that 8 foot isn't high enough for the NESC. (side note- The bucket on those trucks zooms out 22 ft easy. So if you put your service mast where they can reach with the boom, then the higher requirement for the clearance should not be a problem for the poco crew).

 

[ishium 80439]

The roof is definately less than 4/12. It was a cobbled on homeowner special- either that or built before building codes cared about such thing.

The service and drop are in the back of the home so a boom truck is not an option without taking down their fence and driving across the lawn.

I'm going back to rough the interior tomorrow. I'm going to reappraise the situation but I'm really leaning toward making an issue of this. As I stated earlier I have run into the same problem in other jurisdictions in the area. The POCO didn't want it higher and the AHJ's deferred to them. Asking for 5' clearance seems absolutely arbitrary and not backed by anything in writing that I can find.

 

[juptonstone]

Contact the engineer at the utility. Have him meet you at the job site. Show him what the problem is, and describe your solution. The utility engineers are generally pretty open to suggestion and will work with you if you work with them. If possible see if the inspector will meet both of there as well. My experience is that if they feel "included" in the process, both engineers and inspectors are much more willing to meet in the middle, or even to acquiese.

 

[mcclary's electrical]

Contact the engineer at the utility. Have him meet you at the job site. Show him what the problem is, and describe your solution. The utility engineers are generally pretty open to suggestion and will work with you if you work with them. If possible see if the inspector will meet both of there as well. My experience is that if they feel "included" in the process, both engineers and inspectors are much more willing to meet in the middle, or even to acquiese.

This is excellent advise