Driving ground rods can be scary

[pushpenny]

Why can't you attach to the existing wire? Does the inspector wish to see the tops of the ground rods?

Their is no existing wire, im adding a new meter and disconnect.

 

[curt swartz]

Even if you add an electrode for your new service it still needs to connect to the existing grounding electrode system.

 

[hurk27]

I have never been a big fan of driving ground rods without knowing what lies below. I have a job coming up where i have to add 400 amps to an existing service on the back of a shopping mall. The asphault goes right up to the building. I will hammer drill through the asphault then drive my rod. Any suggestions or tips on how thick my gloves should be or better yet how long a handle i need on my sledge lol. Im sure many of you have done this before hoping their wasnt a sewer line or worse a primary lying below YIKES!

So why are we adding ground rods to an existing system? wasn't there grounding electrodes installed for the original service? they can be used for the addition?

Edited again, didn't see the last page

 

[mxslick]

Even with a dig alert or locate, you can still get burned..almost literally. Some yeas ago while working with an EC on a light commercial install, I was helping to drive a new ground rod. The nearest locate was several feet away so we thought we were safe.

My co-worker was on a short ladder with the power hammer and I was holding the rod, thankfully with rubber gloves and leather over gloves on.

After we got about 3-4 feet in, I noticed what I thought was smoke coming up around the rod, which I dismissed as the extremely dry topsoil.

Well, a very loud bang some distance away caught our attention, as we had driven the rod right through a buried 12kV feeder..the bang was the cutouts on the pole blowing.

Luckily for us, we were both wearing gloves, and since the locate was obviously wrong we didn't have to pay for the damage, but we still had to deal with the fallout of all the angry businesses on that UG that we penetrated.

Locates provide a fair degree of clearance, but NEVER take for granted you could still hit something..so wear protection and go carefully!

 

[hurk27]

Even with a dig alert or locate, you can still get burned..almost literally. Some yeas ago while working with an EC on a light commercial install, I was helping to drive a new ground rod. The nearest locate was several feet away so we thought we were safe.

My co-worker was on a short ladder with the power hammer and I was holding the rod, thankfully with rubber gloves and leather over gloves on.

After we got about 3-4 feet in, I noticed what I thought was smoke coming up around the rod, which I dismissed as the extremely dry topsoil.

Well, a very loud bang some distance away caught our attention, as we had driven the rod right through a buried 12kV feeder..the bang was the cutouts on the pole blowing.

Luckily for us, we were both wearing gloves, and since the locate was obviously wrong we didn't have to pay for the damage, but we still had to deal with the fallout of all the angry businesses on that UG that we penetrated.

Locates provide a fair degree of clearance, but NEVER take for granted you could still hit something..so wear protection and go carefully!

Yea we still got taken to court over me shutting down half the city of Portage, we had locates and digging in a sewer line (yea I know not electrical) with my backhoe, I hit the 12400/7200 volt primary's and secondaries all in the same trench, as well as the telephone and cable trunk lines, lucky the gas main was about 2' further in toward the house, and I just scraped it, here they even put the gas in the same trench but didn't on this one, that would have been a big mess, and or I probably wouldn't be here.

The locates had marked on both the neighbors drives (yea they were mad) with big arrows pointing to the lot saying "NO UTILITIES"
lucky for us we had taken photo's of all locate messages and after the damages of all damages, and when we showed up in court with out a lawyer the judge wanted to know why, we just handed her the photo's and said we don't need one we have these.

Well to the point I'm making:

Always keep a camera handy, always take photos of the locates, the dig, the damage if done, and the install, this way you have sound proof.

Oh the locate company had to pay for the big hole in my bucket also.

 

[pushpenny]

So why are we adding ground rods to an existing system? wasn't there grounding electrodes installed for the original service? they can be used for the addition?

Edited again, didn't see the last page

I did look today at the other side of the building at the exact
same setup as I have on my side. Some other contractor added 400 amps to their bank of 6 meters (after the pour of concrete and asphault). They did not have a ground rod present, so makes me wander where they picked up their ground maybe all the way back to the main 800 amp switch, and the only ground I see present their is a building steel bond. I spoke with a electrician who was over the building of the service and he said they have a delta ground system on the rods. Any input would be greatly appreciated.

 

[hillbilly1]

I had a locate that they marked the gas line going to the property that I was working on, but failed to mark the other line that crossed that property from the same tap point on the street main going to the property next door. Got the trench all the way from the service to within 15' of the pole, turned the trencher around to trench back from the pole, hit that gas line right at the intersection of the trench. The utility locate service tried to weasel out of it by saying part of the trench was on the other property. Problem was, were I hit it was still on the property that the locate was called in on. The office never did say whether we ended up paying or not.

 

[480sparky]

I had a locate that they marked the gas line going to the property that I was working on, but failed to mark the other line that crossed that property from the same tap point on the street main going to the property next door. Got the trench all the way from the service to within 15' of the pole, turned the trencher around to trench back from the pole, hit that gas line right at the intersection of the trench. The utility locate service tried to weasel out of it by saying part of the trench was on the other property. Problem was, were I hit it was still on the property that the locate was called in on. The office never did say whether we ended up paying or not.

Was your proposed trench line marked with white paint / flags?

 

[robbietan]

Good idea..... this might sound ignorant gut can they locate through asphault? and if so do you have to pay for the locate?

usually an EMF meter is used to locate where underground lines are. however, these do not tell how deep the lines are buried

 

[hillbilly1]

Was your proposed trench line marked with white paint / flags?

Yes, but only one address was used. Still doesn't clear them from liability because the line was hit on the property listed. If it had been hit on the other property, they may have had a case. I had a locate done on my property for a new line I was installing to a outbuilding across a gravel road. The path was marked with white paint, and when they came out, they only marked the phone line going to my house. I knew for a fact there was a line buried along the edge of the road. Could have trenched right across it and they would have had to eat it, but being a nice guy, I made them come back out and relocate the other line which was clearly visible in their pedestal, but they didn't know where it went until I showed them. They had not bothered to try to find it.

 

[hurk27]

I did look today at the other side of the building at the exact
same setup as I have on my side. Some other contractor added 400 amps to their bank of 6 meters (after the pour of concrete and asphault). They did not have a ground rod present, so makes me wander where they picked up their ground maybe all the way back to the main 800 amp switch, and the only ground I see present their is a building steel bond. I spoke with a electrician who was over the building of the service and he said they have a delta ground system on the rods. Any input would be greatly appreciated.

Here is a graphic of what I was talking about and perficly legal:

Note the two services shareing the same electrode.

 

[busman]

Even with a dig alert or locate, you can still get burned..almost literally. Some yeas ago while working with an EC on a light commercial install, I was helping to drive a new ground rod. The nearest locate was several feet away so we thought we were safe.

My co-worker was on a short ladder with the power hammer and I was holding the rod, thankfully with rubber gloves and leather over gloves on.

After we got about 3-4 feet in, I noticed what I thought was smoke coming up around the rod, which I dismissed as the extremely dry topsoil.

Well, a very loud bang some distance away caught our attention, as we had driven the rod right through a buried 12kV feeder..the bang was the cutouts on the pole blowing.

Luckily for us, we were both wearing gloves, and since the locate was obviously wrong we didn't have to pay for the damage, but we still had to deal with the fallout of all the angry businesses on that UG that we penetrated.

Locates provide a fair degree of clearance, but NEVER take for granted you could still hit something..so wear protection and go carefully!

Yeah. I've had people look at me funny for wearing Class 1's when driving ground rods. Beats the alternatives.

Mark

 

[cowboyjwc]

If you think driving one is scary, try driving 30 in a plant were all of the subfeeds are under the slab.:roll: