Dock wiring Questions

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There's not a lot of info out there on dock wiring. I'm reaching out to you guys for some assistance.

We are working with an engineer to wire a dock . They know their design needs to be improved. so please don't beat them up too bad. Plans have called for a pedestal mounted 400a , 208/120v ,3 phase service on shore. Then feed the dock with a GFI three phase breaker to the first pedestal with feed through lugs to the next pedestal. Pedestals have two 50a and four 30a single phase twist locks receptacles each for a total of two pedestals with further expansion of four more. Slips are 40 and 30 foot long. So here are my Q's.

Most boats that are 20 to 40 long are wired 240volt single phase, can they be fed with 208 single phase?

I don't think the 200amp GFI breaker is required or needed and may even be unwanted do to nuisance tripping.

Plans call for a 200a pin and sleeve receptacle fed under ground mounted at the beginning of the dock at the shore for winter disconnect. Trouble is the receptacle can be subject to submersion and ice damage in the spring with snow melt ( this is a river ). Any practical way to disconnect the docks? Service is 80 ft away.
 

charlie b

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Retired Electrical Engineer
? 50 times two times 208 equals 20,800 VA.
? 30 times four times 120 equals 14,400 VA.
? Total connected load per pole equals 35,200 VA.
? Total connected load for six poles equals 211,100.
? Allowable demand factor per table 555.12 is 60% (for 36 receptacles)
? Demand load is 60% of 211,200, or 126,720 VA.
? Equivalent current is 352.

I conclude that the service size is correct. However, if you can justify the assumption that the 30 amp and 50 amp receptacles would not be used at the same time, you can just calculate on the basis of the 50 amp receptacles. That would bring it down to 277 amps, or a 300 amp service.

No you don?t need, or want, GFCI protection at the service point.

I once did a study for a planned renovation of a large marina. I contacted boat manufacturers all over the world. Every one told me that they would not approve of a 208 volt feed to their 50 amp, 250 volt rated cords.

I can?t help with the connection question.
 

augie47

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Welcome to the Forum

There's not a lot of info out there on dock wiring. I'm reaching out to you guys for some assistance..

Be sure to look at Art 555
We are working with an engineer to wire a dock . They know their design needs to be improved. so please don't beat them up too bad. Plans have called for a pedestal mounted 400a , 208/120v ,3 phase service on shore. Then feed the dock with a GFI three phase breaker to the first pedestal with feed through lugs to the next pedestal. Pedestals have two 50a and four 30a single phase twist locks receptacles each for a total of two pedestals with further expansion of four more. Slips are 40 and 30 foot long. So here are my Q's.

Most boats that are 20 to 40 long are wired 240volt single phase, can they be fed with 208 single phase?.
(There may have been a change in the '11 Code).
See the FPN at 555.19(A)(3). 208 voltage systems are discouraged
( I was typing as Charlie b was posting his valuable documentation)

I don't think the 200amp GFI breaker is required or needed and may even be unwanted do to nuisance tripping. .

I agree wholeheartedly

Plans call for a 200a pin and sleeve receptacle fed under ground mounted at the beginning of the dock at the shore for winter disconnect. Trouble is the receptacle can be subject to submersion and ice damage in the spring with snow melt ( this is a river ). Any practical way to disconnect the docks? Service is 80 ft away.


I can't imagine that being acceptable to the AHJ>
Why do we need to disconnect ?
 
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charlie b

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(There may have been a change in the '11 Code).
No change in the text or the note that follows.

See the FPN at 555.19(A)(3). 208 voltage systems are discouraged.
I hadn't noticed that before. The text of 555.19(A)(3) seems to me to absolutely forbid using a 208 volt supply for a shore power receptacle rated at 250 volts.
Why do we need to disconnect ?
I think this is an owner's desire issue. I surmise that in the winter in that area, they take all boats out of the water, and therefore don't need the power on the dock. So perhaps it is just a safety consideration. Though I suppose you could achieve the same thing by opening and locking out the supply breaker to the transfomer.

 
Dock wiring

Dock wiring

Thanks for the replies.

Yes, Up here in the rust belt we due need to remove boats and docks in the fall. I see no alternative but to have the owner pull out the wires that fed the dock from the u.g. conduit each fall. A 200a receptacle would be submerged come spring.
 

kevin

Member
Location
Post Falls, ID
No you don’t need, or want, GFCI protection at the service point.
New section 555.3 of the 2011 National Electrical Code:
"Ground Fault Protection. The main overcurrent protective device that feeds the marina shall have ground fault protection not exceeding 100 mA. Ground-fault protection of each individual branch or feeder circuit shall be permitted as a suitable alternative."

Why one of the "ground faults" is hyphenated in 555.3, and the other is not, is a great mystery.
 
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charlie b

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I am not sure of the intent of that new code article. But the notion of "Ground Fault Protection" (with or without the hyphen) is not the same as "Ground Fault Circuit Interrupter."

Can anyone post the ROP on this one?
 

jumper

Senior Member
I am not sure of the intent of that new code article. But the notion of "Ground Fault Protection" (with or without the hyphen) is not the same as "Ground Fault Circuit Interrupter."

Can anyone post the ROP on this one?

ROP:
19-252 Log #4766 NEC-P19 Final Action: Reject
(555.3)
_______________________________________________________________
Submitter: Joseph P. Fello, Eaton Corp.
Recommendation: Add new text to read as follows:
555.3 Personnel Protection. GFCI protection for personnel shall be provided
for the marina distribution system. The GFCI protection for personnel shall be
provided in either the main over current protective device, or in the over
current protective devices of each individual branch or feeder circuit.
Substantiation: Shore power leakage currents on board vessel or due to aging
infrastructure, lack of maintenance, conduit and or wire corrosion, etc. pose a
hazard for potential leakage to ground that may cause electric shock drowning,
fire, wasted energy, and property damage. GFCI protection for personnel will
add protection from such occasions. I have provided additional information
from the Mike Holt Newsletter dated October 17, 2007.
Note: Supporting material is available for review at NFPA Headquarters.
Panel Meeting Action: Reject
Panel Statement: Although the recommendation has merit, additional
technical substantiation and product development is needed. The use of GFCI
for personnel protection is not prohibited by the current code. The proposed
requirement for GFCI personnel protection (6 mA leakage) is not practical for
all marina environments.
Number Eligible to Vote: 9
Ballot Results: Affirmative: 8 Negative: 1
Explanation of Negative:
MICHAELIS, R.: Ground fault monitoring is now recommended in the
Marina Electrical Safety Standard NFPA-303-2006.
Marinas have both a legal and moral obligation to provide guests, customers,
and marina personnel with the safest environment possible. This standard
describes ?best practices? that were authored by knowledgeable people in the
industry and addresses issues that are known causes of injury and property
damage. Ignoring these sections is really not an option. The proposal should be
accepted with the addition of ground fault monitoring and alarms being
available for marinas with qualified supervision.

ROC:

19-189 Log #1612 NEC-P19 Final Action: Accept
(555.3)
_______________________________________________________________
Submitter: Joseph P. Fello, Eaton Corp.
Comment on Proposal No: 19-252
Recommendation: 555.3 Ground Fault Protection. The main over current
protective device which feeds the marina shall have ground fault protection not
exceeding 100mA. Ground fault protection of each individual branch or feeder
circuit shall be permitted as a suitable alternative.
Substantiation: Eaton appreciates that panel?s recognition of the merit to
requiring a level of ground fault protection on these circuits. The newly proposed
maximum level is meant to address the Panel?s concern around the practical
application for marina environments.
In response to the panel?s request for technical substantiation, the information
attached with Proposal 19-252 included documentation of incidents in which
more than 50 people died and over 30 people have been injured due to leakage
currents on or around marinas.
Panel Meeting Action: Accept
Number Eligible to Vote: 10
Ballot Results: Affirmative: 9 Negative: 1
Explanation of Negative:
CHILTON, R.: As noted in the Panel Statement for initially rejecting the
proposal, it?s not the idea that a greater level of protection is warranted but the
availability of equipment to sufficiently address several issues as a reason for
the action. To protect personnel with GFCI devices, the 6 mA level for leakage
current is a proven factor and within the standards. The 100 mA Ground Fault
Protection supplying a main feeder for a marina will surely provide greater
flexibility for main feeders, and some protection, however there is a significant
problem with practicality for marinas. Perhaps the alternative at this point
would have been to require all branch circuits and individual feeders for each
dock or station to have the GFCI protection, thereby lessening the seriousness
of the entire power supply for the marina to be shut down which could literally
be a hundred vessels or boats. Another issue is the belief that some might have
that they are protected by the 100 mA device on the main, which we know is
not the case as far as personnel protection is concerned. Even when the alternative
for feeder and branch circuit GFCI protection is included, the use of a 100
mA device does not provide the personnel protection expected.
_______________________________________________________________
 

charlie b

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Thanks, Derek. Now I understand the CMP's intent even less. :confused:

100 ma is enough to electrocute a person, even on dry land. A much smaller current flowing through the water is enough to cause a loss of muscle control, so that a person cannot swim to safety (i.e., "electrocution by drowning"). If I were designing a marina, I would put GFCI devices (3-5 ma range) on the branch circuits, rather than a 100 ma device on the main.
 

kevin

Member
Location
Post Falls, ID
I am personally unaware of any GFCI protection for circuits larger than 60 amps, so his suggestion would conceivably be quite costly to implement.
 
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augie47

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Location
Tennessee
Occupation
State Electrical Inspector (Retired)
I am personally unaware of any GFCI protection for circuits larger than 60 amps, so his suggestion would conceivably be quite costly to implement.

Note the wording seems to be calling for 100ms GF protection and not personnel GCFI protection.
Products such as:
http://www.bender.org/rcm.aspx
can provide that with shunt trip breakers, etc.
I side with Charlieb as not being sure what is accomplished, and, I also would probably elect for branch circuit GFCI. Either way it's going to be a PIA, I fear.
 
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