Bends or Elbow

[Alwayslearningelec]

What determines when the electrician would make a bend or put an elbow on? Say of you coming out of a switchboard why would you but the length short to put an elbow on? Thanks.

 

[infinity]

Are you asking what you would do if you didn't have the room for the sweep of the elbow?

 

[Dennis Alwon]

What determines when the electrician would make a bend or put an elbow on? Say of you coming out of a switchboard why would you but the length short to put an elbow on? Thanks.

Expense. If you have many bends then most commercial contractors would have a hydraulic bender. Large conduit 90's are very expensive esp. with couplings at both ends. It is cheaper to bend their own. If you just have one or 2 90's then it may not be worth setting up the bender.

 

[dduffee260]

We bend almost everything. Sometimes we buy smaller GRC Elbows just because they are less labor intensive to put in pre bent. The threading seems to take a while and we have several threaders also. If we are looking for large sweeps we use Cal Pipe in CA for those as they look really good compared to a 881 bent sweep.

 

[kwired]

Type and size of raceway needs consideration also.

Small sizes of EMT are easily bent with hand benders. 1/2 and maybe 3/4 RMC/IMC can also be bent with hand benders somewhat easily. PVC of all sizes is fastest to use an elbow instead of bending an elbow.

 

[Alwayslearningelec]

Are you asking what you would do if you didn't have the room for the sweep of the elbow?

No....thanks.

 

[Alwayslearningelec]

Thanks everyone. Seems like bending is the way to go especially if it is RGS.

 

[Alwayslearningelec]

I was just talking to a PM about this and he said there is no way field bend is cheaper than factory elbow. Taking into account the labor to do a 3-4" bend compared to purchase and install a factory bend I actually don't see how a field bend is a cheaper way to go.... looking at labor units for each in NECA. THis is regarding RGS.

If you have a 100' run with 4 90's and were to use factory bends I would assume (8) 10' lengths and (4) factory bends would get you there. Now if you were to field bend...each bend would shorten the length a little bit so instead of (10) 10' lengths maybe you need (11). So to recap.

Field Bend RGS= (11) 10' lengths(material & labor), (4) field bends(labor)
Factory Elbows+ (8) 10' Lengths(material & labor), (4) factory elbows( material & labor)....i guess there might be a few more cut and threads for this run as opposed to field bending.

So when you add material and labor for each task for each scenario..I am not quite sure that field bending is always cheaper

 

[220/221]

What determines when the electrician would make a bend or put an elbow on? .

Conduit size. I'm only bending up to 1"RMC, 1 1/4" EMT

 

[Alwayslearningelec]

Conduit size. I'm only bending up to 1"RMC, 1 1/4" EMT

3&4"....Mai Tai's are great drinks

 

[Cow]

Alright Horsegoer, what about when a guy needs to a custom kick or a small offset?

You can do most pipe runs with factory bends, but not every pipe run. Sometimes the bender needs to come out.

Here's another one, have you priced raintight emt fittings? Once you get up to the larger sizes like 3-4" you can't tell me it'd be cheaper to use a bunch of couplings and factory bends...

 

[Alwayslearningelec]

Alright Horsegoer, what about when a guy needs to a custom kick or a small offset?

You can do most pipe runs with factory bends, but not every pipe run. Sometimes the bender needs to come out.

Here's another one, have you priced raintight emt fittings? Once you get up to the larger sizes like 3-4" you can't tell me it'd be cheaper to use a bunch of couplings and factory bends...

Not sure i follow what your saying about couplings and vebdsb

 

[Cow]

Not sure i follow what your saying about couplings and vebdsb

That's probably because you're speaking gibberish and I'm speaking English.

 

[Fulthrotl]

I was just talking to a PM about this and he said there is no way field bend is cheaper than factory elbow. Taking into account the labor to do a 3-4" bend compared to purchase and install a factory bend I actually don't see how a field bend is a cheaper way to go.... looking at labor units for each in NECA. THis is regarding RGS.

If you have a 100' run with 4 90's and were to use factory bends I would assume (8) 10' lengths and (4) factory bends would get you there. Now if you were to field bend...each bend would shorten the length a little bit so instead of (10) 10' lengths maybe you need (11). So to recap.

Field Bend RGS= (11) 10' lengths(material & labor), (4) field bends(labor)
Factory Elbows+ (8) 10' Lengths(material & labor), (4) factory elbows( material & labor)....i guess there might be a few more cut and threads for this run as opposed to field bending.

So when you add material and labor for each task for each scenario..I am not quite sure that field bending is always cheaper

there are a number of considerations...

EMT or GRC?
flat and fast, or twisty and turney?
looks good, or uglier than a mud fence.?

a stick of 4" GRC is less than a 4" GRC 90.
last time i checked the 90 was twice the price of a stick.

i have done 4" GRC in refineries and power plants,
with a one shot bender, set up vertically on rails,
i can bend pretty fast, and it fits pretty well.

i can bend a lot faster than i can cut and thread.
i've done it both ways. depends on the
scale of the job. setting up for 1 or 2 bends isn't
cost effective...

rack of pipe in a ditch? need a 51" tall 90? make a
mark on the pipe, put it in the bender use a digital
level, zero it horizontal, and bend. for the first one.
put some tape on the plunger guage, and bend off
that for the rest of them.

it takes longer to put it in and out of the bender
than it does to bend. the bend take about a minute
and a half.

cut and thread a piece of pipe. thread both ends,
spin it together. time it. see how long it takes.

emt... ?

4" run, using factory bent stuff....... oops.
the 90 out of the panel needs to be 27 1/2" to fit.
oh, well, having two couplings butted together
coming out of the panel looks ok... i guess.

and there needs to be a 7" saddle in the middle
of the run to miss structural steel. lessee... um...
a 45, and two 22.5's, and 4 couplings, and then
it's 17" tall, even when trimming them... well we
can roll it over...

how do you sign your work?

one of the nations larger EC's did a data center,
that i got to work on.

instead of 4" emt feeders for the Lieberts, they
used 3 conductor 500 mcm with a ground BX.

method of installation? have six electricians drag it in
under the computer floor, by hand. hard and stupid.

 

[satcom]

Oh yes, get your information from a project manager, I found that if your lucky, one in a hundred may know something about proper trade practices, the guys that have posted here are giving you good information

 

[kwired]

there are a number of considerations...

EMT or GRC?
flat and fast, or twisty and turney?
looks good, or uglier than a mud fence.?

a stick of 4" GRC is less than a 4" GRC 90.
last time i checked the 90 was twice the price of a stick.

i have done 4" GRC in refineries and power plants,
with a one shot bender, set up vertically on rails,
i can bend pretty fast, and it fits pretty well.

i can bend a lot faster than i can cut and thread.
i've done it both ways. depends on the
scale of the job. setting up for 1 or 2 bends isn't
cost effective...

rack of pipe in a ditch? need a 51" tall 90? make a
mark on the pipe, put it in the bender use a digital
level, zero it horizontal, and bend. for the first one.
put some tape on the plunger guage, and bend off
that for the rest of them.

it takes longer to put it in and out of the bender
than it does to bend. the bend take about a minute
and a half.

cut and thread a piece of pipe. thread both ends,
spin it together. time it. see how long it takes.

emt... ?

4" run, using factory bent stuff....... oops.
the 90 out of the panel needs to be 27 1/2" to fit.
oh, well, having two couplings butted together
coming out of the panel looks ok... i guess.

and there needs to be a 7" saddle in the middle
of the run to miss structural steel. lessee... um...
a 45, and two 22.5's, and 4 couplings, and then
it's 17" tall, even when trimming them... well we
can roll it over...

how do you sign your work?

one of the nations larger EC's did a data center,
that i got to work on.

instead of 4" emt feeders for the Lieberts, they
used 3 conductor 500 mcm with a ground BX.

method of installation? have six electricians drag it in
under the computer floor, by hand. hard and stupid.

4" GRC - one 10 foot piece is a stick? What size does it have to be before it grows into a log?

 

[Alwayslearningelec]

Oh yes, get your information from a project manager, I found that if your lucky, one in a hundred may know something about proper trade practices, the guys that have posted here are giving you good information

That's why I post here. I consider you giys the "experts" and HIGHLY respect and appreciate your information. This was some good information. THanks.

 

[Alwayslearningelec]

there are a number of considerations...

EMT or GRC?
flat and fast, or twisty and turney?
looks good, or uglier than a mud fence.?

a stick of 4" GRC is less than a 4" GRC 90.
last time i checked the 90 was twice the price of a stick.

i have done 4" GRC in refineries and power plants,
with a one shot bender, set up vertically on rails,
i can bend pretty fast, and it fits pretty well.

i can bend a lot faster than i can cut and thread.
i've done it both ways. depends on the
scale of the job. setting up for 1 or 2 bends isn't
cost effective...

rack of pipe in a ditch? need a 51" tall 90? make a
mark on the pipe, put it in the bender use a digital
level, zero it horizontal, and bend. for the first one.
put some tape on the plunger guage, and bend off
that for the rest of them.

it takes longer to put it in and out of the bender
than it does to bend. the bend take about a minute
and a half.

cut and thread a piece of pipe. thread both ends,
spin it together. time it. see how long it takes.

emt... ?

4" run, using factory bent stuff....... oops.
the 90 out of the panel needs to be 27 1/2" to fit.
oh, well, having two couplings butted together
coming out of the panel looks ok... i guess.

and there needs to be a 7" saddle in the middle
of the run to miss structural steel. lessee... um...
a 45, and two 22.5's, and 4 couplings, and then
it's 17" tall, even when trimming them... well we
can roll it over...

how do you sign your work?

one of the nations larger EC's did a data center,
that i got to work on.

instead of 4" emt feeders for the Lieberts, they
used 3 conductor 500 mcm with a ground BX.

method of installation? have six electricians drag it in
under the computer floor, by hand. hard and stupid.

THanks for the time to write that. Very informative. THANKS