Out door hot tub install

[Electron_Sam78]

Ok I've never done a hot tub before so someone correct me or add to this if necessary. I'll give the details of the install and what I've learned from reading the code book and some forum posts on the subject
The unit is a self contained hot tub with a non-conductive shell installed outdoors on a 4 foot high elevated deck of a single-family dwelling.

Applicable codes from 2011 NEC (paraphrased):

• 680.12 Maintenance D/C means 5 ft horizontally from wall of tub.
• 680.22(A)(1) Receptacle for tub must be 10 ft away from tub or 6 ft if all the following are met:
  • single receptacles (no duplex)
  • locking type (twist lock)
  • grounding type
  • GFCI protected
• 680.22(A)(2) other receptacles (not for tub) located not less than 6 ft from tub
• 680.26 All metal fittings and equipment must be bonded using #8 solid copper. Fitting less than 4" in any dimension and not pentrating pool more than 1" are exempt from bonding. Pool water must be bonded.
• 680.44 GFCI protection required for tub equipment power supply.

 

[Electron_Sam78]

Forgot to mention that the deck boards are plastic.

 

[infinity]

The disconnecting means needs to be a minimum of 5' from the tub and up to 50' if within sight.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Haven't done too many hot tubs where they are cord and plug but art. 680.22 does not, IMO apply to hot tubs. Most are direct wired but those that have a plug come with a standard GFCI cord cap so a standard recep. is required.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Assuming you are using the TIA on perimeter bonding you should be good there.

 

[Electron_Sam78]

Haven't done too many hot tubs where they are cord and plug but art. 680.22 does not, IMO apply to hot tubs. Most are direct wired but those that have a plug come with a standard GFCI cord cap so a standard recep. is required.

If the tub is not cord and plug then I agree it doesn't apply.

 

[Electron_Sam78]

Assuming you are using the TIA on perimeter bonding you should be good there.

What's TIA?

 

[Dennis Alwon]

If the tub is not cord and plug then I agree it doesn't apply.

Read art. 680.42(A)(2)-- It says nothing about single recep. or twist lock. Everyone I have seen has been a standard receptacle -- the tub comes with a gfci cord cap.

What's TIA?

Tentative interim amendment


You can read it here

 

[Electron_Sam78]

Read art. 680.42(A)(2)-- It says nothing about single recep. or twist lock. Everyone I have seen has been a standard receptacle -- the tub comes with a gfci cord cap.

I don't have my 2011 book at the moment but from what I remember, and looking at the 2008 NEC, 680.42 states that an outdoor installation must comply with parts I & II except as permitted in 680.42(A)(2). From my reading of the latter it looks like the only thing that is permitted in 680.42(A) is a longer cord [15 ft as opposed to the 3 ft restriction in 680.7(A) & 680.21(A)(5)].So, it appears when you combine the evidence a cord of 15ft is permitted in outdoor installs and that a regular cord cap is fine as long as the receptacle is at least 10 feet from the tub. When it gets between 10 feet to 6 feet then the the requirements of 680.22 come into play.

Tentative interim amendment


You can read it here

So Exception 2 means the tub top rim has to be at least 28 inches taller than surrounding surfaces of the perimeter which extends out 30 inches? Hmm what about plastic guard rails of the deck that it is sitting on? No real way to bond those :slaphead:

 

[Dennis Alwon]

IV. Spas and Hot Tubs
680.40 General.
Electrical installations at spas and hot tubs shall comply with the provisions of Part I and Part IV of this article.

680.42 Outdoor Installations.
A spa or hot tub installed outdoors shall comply with the provisions of Parts I and II of this article, except as permitted in 680.42(A) and (B), that would otherwise apply to pools installed outdoors.

The receptacle info for hot tubs is in 680.42(A)(2) so I don't think Part II applies.

Perimeter bonding is different from bonding metal parts. Obviously if you have plastic supports no need to bond.

 

[Electron_Sam78]

The receptacle info for hot tubs is in 680.42(A)(2) so I don't think Part II applies.

680.42 says right in the section that part II applies to outdoor installations of hot tubs. But I see the logic in what you're saying and am inclined to agree simply because it's easier and I want it to be so. However, I just want to be sure. Sounds like a good question to be answered in a Formal Interpretation from the NFPA.

Perimeter bonding is different from bonding metal parts. Obviously if you have plastic supports no need to bond.

I agree. I have read arguments about people being required to put a bond wire in the earth under the deck or staple a wire to the bottom of the deck boards which to me is useless.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

680.42 says right in the section that part II applies to outdoor installations of hot tubs. But I see the logic in what you're saying and am inclined to agree simply because it's easier and I want it to be so. However, I just want to be sure. Sounds like a good question to be answered in a Formal Interpretation from the NFPA.

So when the tub comes in with a GFCI cord plug attached that plugs into a standard receptacle are you going to cut it off and install a twist lock??? Good luck finding one with a gfci built in that the code requires.

 

[Electron_Sam78]

I've been thinking about this, and re-reading it in the 2008 NEC and
680.42(A)(2) talks about the cord and plug while 680.22(A)(1) talks about the receptacle that the cord and plug attaches to. The section 680.42(A)(2) would really supercede 680.7 and 680.21(5). Section 680.22(A)(1) would still apply to outdoor hot tub installations. I think I will submit a FI request

 

[Electron_Sam78]

So when the tub comes in with a GFCI cord plug attached that plugs into a standard receptacle are you going to cut it off and install a twist lock??? Good luck finding one with a gfci built in that the code requires.

If it's less than 10 feet from the tub it looks to me like that's what needs to be done. As far as the GFCI protection goes, why couldn't you install a GFCI receptacle or CB?

 

[Electron_Sam78]

If it's less than 10 feet from the tub it looks to me like that's what needs to be done. As far as the GFCI protection goes, why couldn't you install a GFCI receptacle or CB?

Ok I guess it would be a GFCI CB since I haven't seen a twist lock GFCI receptacle

 

[kwired]

You have not mentioned what the rating of the plug is but from reading the posts so far it is looking like 15 or 20 amp 125 volt is a good possibility.

You did mention in the OP that this is at an outdoor dwelling location. 210.8(A)(3) says this receptacle will be GFCI protected if 15 or 20 amp 125 volt no matter what is plugged into it. Only exception involves de-icing equipment.

 

[Electron_Sam78]

I'm not sure what the rating of the plug is yet. I haven't actually seen the unit and am not even sure if it is cord and plug connected. I'm just going through the applicable code (or what could be applicable) and making sure I understand it correctly. Concerning GFCI protection it looks like 680.44 requires it up to 50 amps

 

[Electron_Sam78]

So here's another related question:

Does 680.22(A)(5) prevent you from running the supply cord through a permanent barrier (such as a deck board) or does it say that if this is done it nullifies the spacing requirement?

 

[Dennis Alwon]

So here's another related question:

Does 680.22(A)(5) prevent you from running the supply cord through a permanent barrier (such as a deck board) or does it say that if this is done it nullifies the spacing requirement?

IMO, that section is for measurement, however 400.8 would not allow it. If the tub is built on a concrete foundation under the deck then this would not be an issue. I am going to bet you get a tub that requires 50 amps. We'll see.....

 

[Electron_Sam78]

IMO, that section is for measurement, however 400.8 would not allow it. If the tub is built on a concrete foundation under the deck then this would not be an issue. I am going to bet you get a tub that requires 50 amps. We'll see.....

Yeah I agree it is for measurement but I was addressing the part where it says "...without piercing a...permanent barrier." Why would it say that if it is disallowed in 400.8? Is it saying that it is not allowed so don't run the cord that way?

I'm thinking you're right about getting a tub requiring 50 amps. The homeowner did mention it would hold a few people. I should be getting more information later on today about it.