Sizing a gutter/wire way?

[Huntxtrm]

I have researched this on here as well. I am kinda confused. I have been sizing gutters by 20% fill up to 30 conductors. 6 times the largest diameter conduit, between conduits on the same plane or at an angle past 30 degrees. Or 8 times for conduit openings directly across from each other. I am going to try to attach a pdf of the setup, I designed to install. It consists of an ATS connecting to a 12"x12"x48" gutter with 4 2-1/2" rigid nipples. Under the gutter is a meter base and a Generator docking station. All connected to the gutter with 2x 2-1/2" rigid. All conductors are 350 kcmil in parallel. (L1,L2,N x2) One set in each conduit. My quiestion is my gutter big enough? I will be extending the load side conductor in the gutter by way of distribution blocks. does my design fall short? the way i fugured it, I could actually get away with a 10"x10". As far as conductors there will be 2 sets from the meter to the preferred in the ATS, 2 sets from the Docking station to the Alternate in the ATS, and 2 sets from the ATS load to the Distribution blocks, 2 Sets from the distribution blocks exiting the gutter to the Panel room. And Thanks ahead, hope i didn't confuse you as much as i did myself.

 

[augie47]

before we get into sizing, are you not in violation of 230.7 ?

 

[Huntxtrm]

I don't think so? They are all service conductors. They are just alternate sevice conductors, Going through the ATS. Is That not right. Seen these put in like this a few times. Doesn't mean its right though.

 

[Little Bill]

before we get into sizing, are you not in violation of 230.7 ?

You're wearing your inspector hat today aren't you?

 

[augie47]

You're wearing your inspector hat today aren't you?

only hat I own

 

[Huntxtrm]

Is it a violation?

 

[augie47]

I don't think so? They are all service conductors. They are just alternate sevice conductors, Going through the ATS. Is That not right. Seen these put in like this a few times. Doesn't mean its right though.

The ATS would have to be service rated (which I believe would require it to have a service disconnect) or have a service disconnect ahead, so any condutors on the load size would no longer be service conductors.

 

[Huntxtrm]

ATS has a 400 amp disconnect incorporated into it. It is service rated. So do i need to seperate my load side conductors? If need be I can. But the still use the same wireway in the ats? Please explain. Thanks

 

[augie47]

IMO, the conductors on the load side of your service rated ATS are feeders (no longer service conductors) and can not share a raceway with service conductors (230.7).
If you can install a divider in the raceway your AHJ may find that acceptable.

 

[Huntxtrm]

I see where you are coming from. There is no AHJ, its a state entity. They are fine with the layout, but i will devide them anyway, if that is ther right thing to do. Now back to sizing. Help, it gotten confusing from reading so many posts on it.

 

[augie47]

I see no sizing problem. You might want to check dimensions of your distribution blocks. Often they affect the size more so than the conductors.

 

[Huntxtrm]

On bending radius? I will need to check specs on that. I am trying to mount them in a manner to avoid as much bending as possible.

 

[Huntxtrm]

And is my metod for gutter sizing right or wrong? if not, can someone step me through the sizing process using my diagram. That way, I will understand.