25 amp breaker?

[alaskan JW]

Bidding a commerical job. First time I ever seen a 25 amp breaker in the panel schedule. Is this common? what is common practice in this situation.
Thank you for any help.

 

[Cow]

They make 'em.

 

[jumper]

Is this for an HVAC unit by chance?

 

[alaskan JW]

its for different commerical kitchen equipment: Freezer 1/2hp, refridgerator 1/2hp, kitchen hood ef 2hp, mau 2hp.

 

[paul]

I used to install them for 2-pole 208V rectifiers installed in telecom buildings.

 

[jumper]

its for different commerical kitchen equipment: Freezer 1/2hp, refridgerator 1/2hp, kitchen hood ef 2hp, mau 2hp.

Yeah, you will odd breaker sizes for that stuff also.

 

[chris kennedy]

I don't have a calculator here but doesn't a 3000 or 3500w resistance type WH at 240v take a 25?

 

[masterinbama]

I don't have a calculator here but doesn't a 3000 or 3500w resistance type WH at 240v take a 25?

Actually a 4500 watt water heater can use one. And at one time Tennessee made you.

4500 / 240 = 18.74 X 125% = 23.44

 

[romeo]

25 amp breaker

25 amp breaker

It is common on ac units, name plate reads max, fuse or breaker size 25A. Many installers do not think they are manufactured, but they are but many suppliers do not stock them. I have turned down many installations with 30 amp breakers,when 25 are required.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

My suppliers stock them. We used to be required to install water heaters on a 25 amp breaker so we used them alot.

 

[jumper]

I don't have a calculator here but doesn't a 3000 or 3500w resistance type WH at 240v take a 25?

There is the idea of running a 4500w WH at 208v that would require a 25 amp breaker also.

http://forums.mikeholt.com/showthread.php?t=130152

 

[jumper]

It is common on ac units, name plate reads max, fuse or breaker size 25A. Many installers do not think they are manufactured, but they are but many suppliers do not stock them. I have turned down many installations with 30 amp breakers,when 25 are required.

This why my first post asked if it was a HVAC unit. My first red tag was on this.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Actually a 4500 watt water heater can use one. And at one time Tennessee made you.

4500 / 240 = 18.74 X 125% = 23.44

We did also so I am curious as to when the 150% rule came in the NEC- art. 422.11(E)(3)

 

[growler]

First time I ever seen a 25 amp breaker in the panel schedule. Is this common? what is common practice in this situation.
Thank you for any help.

They make 'em.

25 amp breakers are sold not only at Home Depot and Lowe's but I think at the local Ace Hardware.

With breakers you can look in the code book to see if its a standard size and if it is then it must be used. 25 amp is a standard size. If it were not a standard size you would be allowed to use the next standard size larger.

 

[augie47]

We did also so I am curious as to when the 150% rule came in the NEC- art. 422.11(E)(3)

Unsure of the excact date, but a 1990 Code Handbook shows water heaters at 125% and a 1999 at 150%

 

[Volta]

We did also so I am curious as to when the 150% rule came in the NEC- art. 422.11(E)(3)

I see it as 1971:

422-27. (e)
When the branch circuit supplies a single nonmotor-operated appliance, rated at 10 amperes or more, the overcurrent device rating shall not exceed 150% of the branch circuit rating.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Unsure of the excact date, but a 1990 Code Handbook shows water heaters at 125% and a 1999 at 150%

That sounds like it.

I see it as 1971:

No, it was much later than that. Only one area required the water heater- 4500 watt element to be on a 25 amp breaker. I did that exclusively for years until they changed it. About 2 years ago I had to change a 25 amp breaker to 30 because Lowes had sold this energy water heater that had 5500 watt or 5000 watt elements. I argued with the installer until I finally asked if the elements were 4500 watts. Had to up it.

 

[GearMan]

Many years ago, MFG's did not offer 25a cb's. As the prior posts indicate, there was a need. Once the NEC included it as a standard size, all NEMA members had to comply with an offering or lose out. I don't have an old enough NEC book anymore to verify.......anyone?

 

[Volta]

That sounds like it.

No, it was much later than that. Only one area required the water heater- 4500 watt element to be on a 25 amp breaker. I did that exclusively for years until they changed it. About 2 years ago I had to change a 25 amp breaker to 30 because Lowes had sold this energy water heater that had 5500 watt or 5000 watt elements. I argued with the installer until I finally asked if the elements were 4500 watts. Had to up it.

Wat do you mean? I think you guys are mixing up 'not less than' and 'not exceed'.

Read it again. Since '71, you couldn't exceed 150% for certain appliances. Water heater, toaster, tracing table, whatever. If it was a nonmotor-operated appliance, over a certain current rating, there was a limit to the maximum size of the OCPD.

The 125% is the minimum size of the circuit for water heaters and other continuous loads. I am not commenting on that first date.