EMT BENDING LABOR

[Alwayslearningelec]

ADo you think these NECA MLU units are realistic. I guess they are considering 2 men on a bender. Columns are normal, difficult andf very difficult

Field Bending EMT Conduit and Installation -
Add approx 10% for each field cut & ream
1 1/4" 0.64 0.80 0.96 E
1 1/2" 0.80 1.00 1.20 E
2" 1.00 1.24 1.50 E
2 1/2" 1.20 1.50 1.80 E
3" 1.40 1.74 2.10 E
3 1/2" 1.70 2.10 2.50 E
4" 2.00 2.50 3.00

 

[Strathead]

ADo you think these NECA MLU units are realistic. I guess they are considering 2 men on a bender. Columns are normal, difficult andf very difficult

Field Bending EMT Conduit and Installation -
Add approx 10% for each field cut & ream
1 1/4" 0.64 0.80 0.96 E
1 1/2" 0.80 1.00 1.20 E
2" 1.00 1.24 1.50 E
2 1/2" 1.20 1.50 1.80 E
3" 1.40 1.74 2.10 E
3 1/2" 1.70 2.10 2.50 E
4" 2.00 2.50 3.00

Personally, I don't think most of the labor units in NECA are realistic. I alos don't think they can be, since there is so much variable to any installation. As a junior estimator, which I am thing you are, you just need to take off the items your boss tells you, and try to pay attention to what he does with them. The goal of a takeoff is to get as close as possible to the actual installation material and labor cost, that the company is going to expend, if they get the project. PERIOD! The goal of an estimate is to get as close as possible to the entire cost of a project, which includes all incidental costs, such as employee training, gas, administration, shop tool and material inventory, future warranty work, overtime, and a hundred other items. The goal of a bid is to use the above information along with knowledge of the local environment, competition, contractor, owner, upcoming work of you and your competition, how bad your competition thinks you want the project, how bad your competition wants the project, all to put a final number together that is exactly low enough to be awarded the job, without leaving any extra money on the table.

How you do each of these things is very individual.

 

[Alwayslearningelec]

Personally, I don't think most of the labor units in NECA are realistic. I alos don't think they can be, since there is so much variable to any installation. As a junior estimator, which I am thing you are, you just need to take off the items your boss tells you, and try to pay attention to what he does with them. The goal of a takeoff is to get as close as possible to the actual installation material and labor cost, that the company is going to expend, if they get the project. PERIOD! The goal of an estimate is to get as close as possible to the entire cost of a project, which includes all incidental costs, such as employee training, gas, administration, shop tool and material inventory, future warranty work, overtime, and a hundred other items. The goal of a bid is to use the above information along with knowledge of the local environment, competition, contractor, owner, upcoming work of you and your competition, how bad your competition thinks you want the project, how bad your competition wants the project, all to put a final number together that is exactly low enough to be awarded the job, without leaving any extra money on the table.

How you do each of these things is very individual.

Thanks...... I was asking that, in general, do you think these units( in the normal column) are high from your experience. I know that abviously if you have 500 hundred bends that unit would be greatly reduced etc.

 

[cdslotz]

NECA units are very high for the most part.
My best frame of reference has always been Koontz labor units.
I may be the only one old enough to know who/what that is.
NECA units are great for arguing change orders

 

[sameguy]

500 hund. bends?
The more bends will not give a lower # due to a greater quantity. More like increase cost unless they are all stub 90deg.

 

[sameguy]

1-1/4", 1-1/2" can all be bent at site by hand benders, the rest will take machine benders. More set up time with machine bender, walking back and forth, waiting your turn; Means book/ NECA has that time in it I think.
Your shop should have its' own time studyed unless new and you should use those numbers.

 

[Alwayslearningelec]

1-1/4", 1-1/2" can all be bent at site by hand benders, the rest will take machine benders. More set up time with machine bender, walking back and forth, waiting your turn; Means book/ NECA has that time in it I think.
Your shop should have its' own time studyed unless new and you should use those numbers.

Are you saying shops keep a record of their actual labor for installtion of material/equipment?

 

[Fulthrotl]

Are you saying shops keep a record of their actual labor for installtion of material/equipment?

at the time i worked for them, the fourth largest EC in the US at that time was doing all that volume on TI work in california, and their
database was so finely tuned they had labor rates and costing for specific CREWS and general foremen.

they knew EXACTLY how much to bid stuff for, and nobody wanted to bid against them. you probably weren't gonna get it, and if
you did, that meant you were gonna lose money.

one day, more out of boredom than anything else, i wanted to see how many 2x4 lights i could get up in a ceiling in a day, and i had
a whole floor... so in 7 hours of production time, i got 155 lights unpacked and up in the ceiling. trust me, i never did something that
silly again. ever.

the next week, there was a handwritten note in my pay envelope from the VP of the southern calif. side of the business, wanting to
know how i did that. it popped up on the database report, and they thought it was a mistake.

i spoke to him on the phone, explaining that it was a big mistake, and i'll never do it again... but i got the impression that when i
went to the porta can in the morning, they probably knew how many sheets of paper i used....

 

[Richardtheelectrician]

Now that's hilarious. I worked for a gung-ho journeyman once who had us lay in all the 2 x 4 fixtures in a commercial building directly from the truck. Apparently he didn't notice the lighting schedule, and that there were 3 different types of fixtures to be installed, you know, where the architect wanted. So we just slammed them in, because they were all 2 x 4's, right?
We spent the next two days sorting out the mess.
He was also the cat who got mad at me because I told him I actually liked doing electric work.

 

[Strathead]

at the time i worked for them, the fourth largest EC in the US at that time was doing all that volume on TI work in california, and their
database was so finely tuned they had labor rates and costing for specific CREWS and general foremen.

they knew EXACTLY how much to bid stuff for, and nobody wanted to bid against them. you probably weren't gonna get it, and if
you did, that meant you were gonna lose money.

one day, more out of boredom than anything else, i wanted to see how many 2x4 lights i could get up in a ceiling in a day, and i had
a whole floor... so in 7 hours of production time, i got 155 lights unpacked and up in the ceiling. trust me, i never did something that
silly again. ever.

the next week, there was a handwritten note in my pay envelope from the VP of the southern calif. side of the business, wanting to
know how i did that. it popped up on the database report, and they thought it was a mistake.

i spoke to him on the phone, explaining that it was a big mistake, and i'll never do it again... but i got the impression that when i
went to the porta can in the morning, they probably knew how many sheets of paper i used....

I am dying to know who that was. Was it Helix? If you won't say, please tell, at least, was it a Union shop or a non-union shop?