Shower light gfci comes up AGAIN

[brother]

Had a person asked me about this topic. Seems this issue keeps coming up again and again in my neck of woods.

They asked why doesn't the NEC require a gfci protection for shower lights in all other areas but it will require it in a park trailer? If height (low ceiling) is the issue for the requirement, why not make it required in all other areas with a maxium height requirement like they do with hot tubs and spas.

A shower is a shower no matter where it is located at, it has the same function. That is to wash/bathe your dirty behind! LOL.

I could only say, "Put in a code proposal, because I had already made that suggestion". Only some manufacturers instructions require them for their install. What do you think?

 

[Dennis Alwon]

What do you mean that it is required in a park trailer-- Mobil Home?, etc. I had not been aware of this but trailers have always had different req. I don't think height is a requirement as a wall sconce can be install over a hydromassage tub without gfci protection also. Generally gfci protection is required for receptacle outlets not equipment

 

[ActionDave]

What Dennis said and the fact that I don't know anybody that decides it is a good Idea to put their finger in a light socket while they are taking a shower.

 

[brother]

What do you mean that it is required in a park trailer-- Mobil Home?, etc. I had not been aware of this but trailers have always had different req. I don't think height is a requirement as a wall sconce can be install over a hydromassage tub without gfci protection also. Generally gfci protection is required for receptacle outlets not equipment

For Park Trailers See 2008 NEC 552.54(B) Shower Luminaires. I was told that gfci requirement was supported because the height of ceilings in Park trailers.
Hot tubs and spas take a look at 680.43(B)(1), mostly has a 12ft height requirement to get away from having a gfci protection for the luminaire.

 

[brother]

What Dennis said and the fact that I don't know anybody that decides it is a good Idea to put their finger in a light socket while they are taking a shower.

See Post #4, my response to Dennis.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

See Post #4, my response to Dennis.

I said hydromassage tubs not hot tubs

 

[Dennis Alwon]

I guess I didn't realize there was a section called park trailers. These are mobile units on wheels that are brought in for recreational purpose. Because they are mobile I am guessing that there is a fear connections are more likely to come loose so the extra precaution in the shower is taken.

 

[A/A Fuel GTX]

Had a person asked me about this topic. Seems this issue keeps coming up again and again in my neck of woods.

They asked why doesn't the NEC require a gfci protection for shower lights in all other areas but it will require it in a park trailer? If height (low ceiling) is the issue for the requirement, why not make it required in all other areas with a maxium height requirement like they do with hot tubs and spas.

A shower is a shower no matter where it is located at, it has the same function. That is to wash/bathe your dirty behind! LOL.

I could only say, "Put in a code proposal, because I had already made that suggestion". Only some manufacturers instructions require them for their install. What do you think?

Which leads me to the topic of bathroom exhaust fans which most if not all mfgrs require the fan be connected to a GFCI protected circuit if installed within the bathtub/shower space. Why??? The fan is recessed in the ceiling and has a plastic grill over the goods. I can place a recessed can in the same area all day long, in a commercial/residential setting and not have to GFCI protect it. Another one of those mysteries of life.

 

[augie47]

What Dennis said and the fact that I don't know anybody that decides it is a good Idea to put their finger in a light socket while they are taking a shower.

You have not been in some of the trailer parks in my area thus the requirement in the Park Trailer Section.
"Betty-Sue, hold my beer whilst I change this bulb"

(The devil made me post this)

 

[brother]

Which leads me to the topic of bathroom exhaust fans which most if not all mfgrs require the fan be connected to a GFCI protected circuit if installed within the bathtub/shower space. Why??? The fan is recessed in the ceiling and has a plastic grill over the goods. I can place a recessed can in the same area all day long, in a commercial/residential setting and not have to GFCI protect it. Another one of those mysteries of life.

I was told that the heat and moisture going into the fan has a higher likely hood of corroding the egc. I have heard stories of people who claim to have gotten shocked in the shower, and when it was investigated the current was coming from the light or fan in the shower. Mostly fans. turns out the egc didn't allow enough current to open the breaker.

 

[brother]

I said hydromassage tubs not hot tubs

I started my post talking about hot tubs and spas. I understand the difference, but its really spliting hairs on the NEC defintions of hydromassage tubs (drainage after each use) and hot tubs (not intended to drain after each use), even though there is slight difference. Depending on the AHJ's interpertation, once can say that all hydromassage tubs are hot tubs, but not all hot tubs are hydromassage tubs.

It wouldn't do any harm to put a luminaire over a 'hydro massage tub' on a gfci.

 

[A/A Fuel GTX]

I was told that the heat and moisture going into the fan has a higher likely hood of corroding the egc. I have heard stories of people who claim to have gotten shocked in the shower, and when it was investigated the current was coming from the light or fan in the shower. Mostly fans. turns out the egc didn't allow enough current to open the breaker.

Perhaps with AL wire but copper corroding? How can someone get shocked in the shower from a fan or light above unless they are making physical contact with the unit?

 

[brother]

Perhaps with AL wire but copper corroding? How can someone get shocked in the shower from a fan or light above unless they are making physical contact with the unit?

Not sure, maybe it was a tall guy or woman and they lifted their arms to wash under them. Maybe the screw or the can itself that rusted or corroded and the egc got lose. I'm only telling what I heard. I wish I could find the old code proposals that would show the substantiation.