When to leave.

Status
Not open for further replies.

billdozier 78

Member
Location
Orlando
Want you guys opinion on something. I bounce around a lot. Due to layoffs or slow downs. Most companies gladly hire me back due to my work ethic. That includes my current one. But my resume lacks that long term histor y with one company. We hit a snag and I've not been called in since Tuesday. They said the rest of the week looks bleak. Like most of us I bet this economy has hit my savings hard. I can hold out till next week,but if I get a call from another company should I take it? What do you guys that hire look for on a resume? When do you guys look to leave for another company? Thanks sorry for the long post.
 

Fishspark

Member
Location
Wisconsin
Occupation
Electrician
just a thought

just a thought

You?ll have to make a decision based on what you?re looking for. ? If you like the Company you are with ? open a dialog and discuss your options with them ? hopefully it?s just a bump in the road along the way - but sometimes things just happen for a bigger reason then we know.
 

joeblurton

Member
Location
Fargo ND
Bounce around a lot

Bounce around a lot

I do the same, in about 40 years the longest one job was 4 years. If you want to travel there is always a high overtime job out there, always. Just start looking for the next job when the end is near; maintain the resume. The whole purpose of construction is to work yourself out of a job! Oh, make sure you maintain a savings account for the lean times...
 
Are you willing to reloacate.

Are you willing to reloacate.

I understand they are always looking for good electricians in Midland Texas. They are getting people to come in from many surounding states.
hope this helps.... JIm
 

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
How willing are you to relocate?

I bet you can find a job at/near oilfields in North Dakota fairly easily, but will be a big change from Orlando.
 

cowboyjwc

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Simi Valley, CA
I guess that's why we are called journeymen.

Personally, I think a guy that has worked for many contractors on many types of jobs will be a better hand than one that stayed at a single, nice, comfy company for 20 years.

Yeah, but when you do hiring, and look at a resume like that. You can't read that into it. Could just be that the guys a flake or doesn't get along with people. I'm only on my third job since 1979 and I've been here for just shy of 23 years.
 

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
I guess that's why we are called journeymen.

Personally, I think a guy that has worked for many contractors on many types of jobs will be a better hand than one that stayed at a single, nice, comfy company for 20 years.
And there as many reasons to leave as there was number of jobs.

The guy obviously has had experiences over 20 years, but were they good ones or bad ones or a mix of both? Did he leave on his own or did they make him leave? Was it simply because there was no work, or did he have problems or did some of the companies he worked for have problems?

Lots of reasons are possible. A guy that stays in one place for a long time can be just as questionable. Did he stay in same position all 20 years or did he advance within the ranks? Is the guy now the VP of the company or is he still at about the same rank as new apprentices?
 

K8MHZ

Senior Member
Location
Michigan. It's a beautiful peninsula, I've looked
Occupation
Electrician
Yeah, but when you do hiring, and look at a resume like that. You can't read that into it. Could just be that the guys a flake or doesn't get along with people. I'm only on my third job since 1979 and I've been here for just shy of 23 years.

Our backgrounds are probably different. Mine is construction. When the job is over, we get laid off and go work for a different contractor on a different job. People that stay with the companies are called 'Shop Rockets'. I have no idea why, but I can assure you it's not a term of endearment.

I just checked our phone book and of the 58 ECs listed, I found 10 that had been around longer than 23 years. It's kind of tough to stay somewhere that goes out of business. I can think of at least 4 places I worked for that are now no longer in business. That accounts for about half of the contractors I worked for since getting 'legally' into the trade. The ones that didn't fold had to lay off 3/4 of their help.

So if things are like they are here, I sure wouldn't hold having multiple employers against anyone looking for work.
 

renosteinke

Senior Member
Location
NE Arkansas
At my workstation (wherever it may be this week) I hang two sheets of paper.

One is a picture of my house, when I bought it. It reminds me of the remodeling project, my cats, and the other priorities in my personal life.

The other is a sign I made, to the effect of "It's all about hellping the customer get his job done." That is, it remids me of what really matters, at the end of the job.

It's all about keeping your eye on the ball -at work and at home. You need these 'anchors' to help you make the right choices.

I also have a little list I made, that holds my answer to "What do I want from a job?" My list contains seven items, seven basic desires. I continually measure every job against this 'scorecard.' This helps me consider other offers, to make the best choices for me. It also tells me what the 'deal breakers' are.

Not everyone will have the same seven priorities, so I won't list mine here. There is no 'right' list. For example, one man might consider traveling a good thing, while another might be tied to one location. What's important is that it be YOUR list.
 

brian john

Senior Member
Location
Leesburg, VA
I guess that's why we are called journeymen.

Personally, I think a guy that has worked for many contractors on many types of jobs will be a better hand than one that stayed at a single, nice, comfy company for 20 years.

Depends on the company, one small firm I worked for we did industrial, churches, schools, hospitals and residential, I learned a lot in those 5 years.

I tend to agree with the variety of projects, which is why I like the fact that some apprentice programs have the apprentice transfers, but when I hire I prefer a more stable employment history. I am going to expend considerable time and money training a JW and I would like to think he will stay with me for a long period.
 

ActionDave

Chief Moderator
Staff member
Location
Durango, CO, 10 h 20 min from the winged horses.
Occupation
Licensed Electrician
... but when I hire I prefer a more stable employment history. I am going to expend considerable time and money training a JW and I would like to think he will stay with me for a long period.
How would you view an applicant who had bounced around in his younger days but decided to look for some stable employment?
 

cowboyjwc

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Simi Valley, CA
Our backgrounds are probably different. Mine is construction. When the job is over, we get laid off and go work for a different contractor on a different job. People that stay with the companies are called 'Shop Rockets'. I have no idea why, but I can assure you it's not a term of endearment.

I just checked our phone book and of the 58 ECs listed, I found 10 that had been around longer than 23 years. It's kind of tough to stay somewhere that goes out of business. I can think of at least 4 places I worked for that are now no longer in business. That accounts for about half of the contractors I worked for since getting 'legally' into the trade. The ones that didn't fold had to lay off 3/4 of their help.

So if things are like they are here, I sure wouldn't hold having multiple employers against anyone looking for work.

Was with the first company for six years. The owner really liked me for some reason and we would hire and let go on a regular bases, but I was never out of work until right after I got married, I mean like a month after and we slowed down a little and I sat home for two weeks and my wife wasn't very happy about that. So a friend of mine was an engineer in the maintenance department of a world wide corp. and asked if I was interested in coming to work there as a maintenance electrician. Insurance, vacation and sick time, stock options, profit sharing, etc. and we only worked, as a rule, forty hours a week so I was free to do my own thing on the side. Made it through about seven layoffs until I got caught up in the last one, mostly because of my side work, they knew I would be ok, but the fifty year old guy wouldn't be so lucky. I basically walked out the door, saw the ad for this job and applied and have been here ever since. There's a lot more benifits to this job than what the job offers, I live in town, it's a small town so I can be to work in 5 minutes. I go home for lunch every day so I save that money. My elderly dad and mother-in-law, live in town so if they need something I can swing by, I'm the #1 conctact for my grandkids school, etc. I've said it before, there's more to a job sometimes than just the money.
 

K8MHZ

Senior Member
Location
Michigan. It's a beautiful peninsula, I've looked
Occupation
Electrician
About 1/2 way through my apprenticeship they mandated 'forced rotation' on the apprentices. If you worked for one contractor for more than 6 months you would get rotated to another contractor. Some of the guys were ticked off, but they also were 'specialized' and didn't know much outside their comfort zone.

I really like going from one place to another. It was like an adventure. New guys, new bosses, new rules and new tricks of the trade.

My first gig was with a company that had maintenance contracts. We were in a baby formula plant. I learned how to run aluminum and also how to do 'picture perfect' work, as that was a big thing on that job.

From there, I went to building the biggest high school in the area. I pulled 35.4 miles of #8 off spools, up three levels to a shiv and from there to a dimmer room and out.

Also, not in any particular order, I got to install pollution control equipment on a coal burning power plant, fire suppression equipment on another, helped build and test conductors at a jet turbine power plant, worked building a line at Keebler where Pop Tarts were made, helped build a jail in the middle of a very cold winter in Baldwin, MI (75 mile drive, one way, that job sucked), went down to work at Mittal #2 in Gary, one of the largest steel mills there is. There are more, and I think I went through a half dozen contractors, at least.

Then, the bottom fell out of the construction business. So I went to work for a residential contractor. I had never run Romex before, so new skills were being learned. The first company went out of business, but at least I learned how to put in a residential service, something that would make me money when I needed it in years to come. Then, a foreman I worked for at a power plant started up a business and asked me to work for him. There were 4 of us, and for a couple years things were good. Our gigs, beside light commercial and res work, was putting in ATS units for Verizon all over the state. We were a sub for a long standing local communications company. Verizon folded, stopped all our work, and now we were down to pretty much part time and running electrical stuff for the comm company. That went out of business. And so on. I don't even try to list all that stuff on a resume.

Every place I worked I learned a different skill set, one I wouldn't have if I stayed at one place. Skill sets include running pipe, reading prints, working with engineers, troubleshooting, working with inspectors, pulling wire, building trapeze and cable tray, operating heavy equipment, installing services, and more.

So, despite my apparent 'instability', the up shot is I don't really need much training to do most work. Most of the time my instructions are 'go see so and so and take care of it' or I get a page or two of prints with circles around stuff I'm supposed to get done.

The last union job I did was doing the refrigeration controls for a 375,000 sq. foot grocery / department store. I get there and it's me and another j-man, the son of one of my former bosses, trying to figure out what we were supposed to be doing. Neither one of us had run refrigeration controls before. EC shows up, leaves one guy behind for one week to 'train' us. From that point on, for 6 months, me and the other j-man never saw anyone from the company except for pay day or when stuff like big tools were moved. No problem. Once we got the gist of things and the EC knew we could read prints, we just built the place. No need for a foreman.

Being an 'electrician' can mean so many things. When hiring, I guess it's important to know who will work out best, the self sufficient guy that can not only work with out much or any training, and is one that is used to going without work for several weeks a year vs. a 'steady' that has only been at one place and is NOT used to going without work? Are you sure you can even provide an environment a steady wants?

Case in point. When I was just out of high school I worked for a cam shaft company that had been around for decades. About 20 years later I had decided that I was sick of driving all over creation as an electrician to work mostly outdoors. I read that the company was hiring for a maint. tech, which is what I had done there years ago. I went on an interview to find out the company was now owned by the Chinese. But they assured me they weren't going anywhere. The pay was OK for a layperson, but not quite what a licensed electrician made. So I didn't consider the job. A year later they moved the entire plant to China and laid off all the people that worked there. Besides those people, consider the small businesses that were hurt by that move. I'll bet at least one electrician from an outside company lost his job because of the move. This was a big place, the place that all Isky, Crane and OEM Ford, GM and MoPar cams were once made.

Today's environment is not the same. It's no longer as important to dedicate yourself to a single employer 'till retirement as it is to be flexible and prepared to lose your job at any time.
 
Last edited:

cowboyjwc

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Simi Valley, CA
About 1/2 way through my apprenticeship they mandated 'forced rotation' on the apprentices. If you worked for one contractor for more than 6 months you would get rotated to another contractor. Some of the guys were ticked off, but they also were 'specialized' and didn't know much outside their comfort zone.

I really like going from one place to another. It was like an adventure. New guys, new bosses, new rules and new tricks of the trade.

My first gig was with a company that had maintenance contracts. We were in a baby formula plant. I learned how to run aluminum and also how to do 'picture perfect' work, as that was a big thing on that job.

From there, I went to building the biggest high school in the area. I pulled 35.4 miles of #8 off spools, up three levels to a shiv and from there to a dimmer room and out.

Also, not in any particular order, I got to install pollution control equipment on a coal burning power plant, fire suppression equipment on another, helped build and test conductors at a jet turbine power plant, worked building a line at Keebler where Pop Tarts were made, helped build a jail in the middle of a very cold winter in Baldwin, MI (75 mile drive, one way, that job sucked), went down to work at Mittal #2 in Gary, one of the largest steel mills there is. There are more, and I think I went through a half dozen contractors, at least.

Then, the bottom fell out of the construction business. So I went to work for a residential contractor. I had never run Romex before, so new skills were being learned. The first company went out of business, but at least I learned how to put in a residential service, something that would make me money when I needed it in years to come. Then, a foreman I worked for at a power plant started up a business and asked me to work for him. There were 4 of us, and for a couple years things were good. Our gigs, beside light commercial and res work, was putting in ATS units for Verizon all over the state. We were a sub for a long standing local communications company. Verizon folded, stopped all our work, and now we were down to pretty much part time and running electrical stuff for the comm company. That went out of business. And so on. I don't even try to list all that stuff on a resume.

Every place I worked I learned a different skill set, one I wouldn't have if I stayed at one place. Skill sets include running pipe, reading prints, working with engineers, troubleshooting, working with inspectors, pulling wire, building trapeze and cable tray, operating heavy equipment, installing services, and more.

So, despite my apparent 'instability', the up shot is I don't really need much training to do most work. Most of the time my instructions are 'go see so and so and take care of it' or I get a page or two of prints with circles around stuff I'm supposed to get done.

The last union job I did was doing the refrigeration controls for a 375,000 sq. foot grocery / department store. I get there and it's me and another j-man, the son of one of my former bosses, trying to figure out what we were supposed to be doing. Neither one of us had run refrigeration controls before. EC shows up, leaves one guy behind for one week to 'train' us. From that point on, for 6 months, me and the other j-man never saw anyone from the company except for pay day or when stuff like big tools were moved. No problem. Once we got the gist of things and the EC knew we could read prints, we just built the place. No need for a foreman.

Being an 'electrician' can mean so many things. When hiring, I guess it's important to know who will work out best, the self sufficient guy that can not only work with out much or any training, and is one that is used to going without work for several weeks a year vs. a 'steady' that has only been at one place and is NOT used to going without work? Are you sure you can even provide an environment a steady wants?

Case in point. When I was just out of high school I worked for a cam shaft company that had been around for decades. About 20 years later I had decided that I was sick of driving all over creation as an electrician to work mostly outdoors. I read that the company was hiring for a maint. tech, which is what I had done there years ago. I went on an interview to find out the company was now owned by the Chinese. But they assured me they weren't going anywhere. The pay was OK for a layperson, but not quite what a licensed electrician made. So I didn't consider the job. A year later they moved the entire plant to China and laid off all the people that worked there. Besides those people, consider the small businesses that were hurt by that move. I'll bet at least one electrician from an outside company lost his job because of the move. This was a big place, the place that all Isky, Crane and OEM Ford, GM and MoPar cams were once made.

Today's environment is not the same. It's no longer as important to dedicate yourself to a single employer 'till retirement as it is to be flexible and prepared to lose your job at any time.

I can respect that. I actually learned a lot working for my self too, makes you think instead of just doing it the way you're told. But then I'm not a big change guy. I've lived in town here for over 30 years and would love to move, but maybe when I retire. I'd hate to move some where for a job and find out I didn't like the job or the location.
 

K8MHZ

Senior Member
Location
Michigan. It's a beautiful peninsula, I've looked
Occupation
Electrician
I can respect that. I actually learned a lot working for my self too, makes you think instead of just doing it the way you're told. But then I'm not a big change guy. I've lived in town here for over 30 years and would love to move, but maybe when I retire. I'd hate to move some where for a job and find out I didn't like the job or the location.

Or the job ended and you were stuck there.

In 2007 there was no work at all here. My cousin ended up in Las Vegas working on a huge casino. He said there was more work there than they could man and no end in sight. He was planning on buying a house there. He wanted me to come out there and work, knowing the bleak nature of Michigan's economy at the time.

Well, no place is immune to a bad economy and he is back in Michigan. Luckily, he didn't buy a house out there.
 

billdozier 78

Member
Location
Orlando
Thanks for the input from all of you guys. I think I'm pretty set on leaving when I get the phone call. I sent my resume to a few different residential/commercial companies. I prefer the pace of residential and service. I tend to sour quickly on going to the same job day after day. Also the company I work for has zero and I mean zero benefits. Add to that the foreman who just won't listen when he is flat out wrong. Prime example a mechanical room maybe 5 feet wide and 30 inches deep. And the 5 feet is being generous. No way is he getting 36 inches on a disco in that room. And the other one's are missing their clearances also. I will miss seeing crap fly that day on final inspection,oh well.
 

K8MHZ

Senior Member
Location
Michigan. It's a beautiful peninsula, I've looked
Occupation
Electrician
Thanks for the input from all of you guys. I think I'm pretty set on leaving when I get the phone call. I sent my resume to a few different residential/commercial companies. I prefer the pace of residential and service. I tend to sour quickly on going to the same job day after day. Also the company I work for has zero and I mean zero benefits. Add to that the foreman who just won't listen when he is flat out wrong. Prime example a mechanical room maybe 5 feet wide and 30 inches deep. And the 5 feet is being generous. No way is he getting 36 inches on a disco in that room. And the other one's are missing their clearances also. I will miss seeing crap fly that day on final inspection,oh well.

It sould like you are not happy where you are. A bad boss can really make a job miserable. Even the best jobs can be spoiled by a bad boss.

Good luck. It works the other way, too. A good boss can make a 'bad job' very enjoyable. I have had both, and I prefer the latter over the former, any day.
 

LEO2854

Esteemed Member
Location
Ma
I guess that's why we are called journeymen.

Personally, I think a guy that has worked for many contractors on many types of jobs will be a better hand than one that stayed at a single, nice, comfy company for 20 years.
That's right,If you can move around you will learn much more about the trade and the different ways people do things.

Writing out some of the details about what you have been doing with each contractor will show the prospective EC that you are a well rounded Journeyman electrician .
 

renosteinke

Senior Member
Location
NE Arkansas
Some additional input from this weekend ....

At the laundromat, we had our weekly meeting of IBEW / FLEa's, guys in town working various projects at the local mills. "When to move on" was a hot topic this time.

Why? Because the biggest job was beginning to wind down. Work weeks were being reduced from 70 hours to ... well, the cycle was beginning. Each man had to know his needs, and decide when to 'reach out' for another job, somewhere else. These guys put the 'journey' in 'journeyman.'

Why would someone want to stick around at all? Because, in a few months, the same mills will have other projects start. Some current projects are behind schedule, and will be needing electricians well after the expected 'completion date.' IOW, the usual construction issues.

Each man has his own priorities. Some have extensive commitments to families in places without work; for them, it's all about the bottom line of the paycheck. Others are not so pressed, and prefer to be somewhat close to home- able to make the 8-hr. drive every few weeks to see the wife & kids.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top