Hot Tub Troublshoot-Worth it?

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GerryB

Senior Member
Location
woodbridge, ct. USA
I told this customer I could really only check the power to it. She is also a neighbor and wanted me to look. I lifted the wires at the tub panel and the breaker did not trip, 50 amp sq D gfi. So my first question is can you ever be sure a gfi breaker is good? This tub had a troubleshooting paper in it so I went a little farther. Unplugged the pump, still tripped. Unplugged the ozone whatever, still tripped. Unplugged two other things, still tripped. There was four fuses that seemed ok with continuity but I didnt' get a reading on them. My other question is do any of you guys bother with this and is it worth getting into? I have had other calls like this and there are not too many companies out there servicing these things.
 
Dennis Alwon

Dennis Alwon

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Chapel Hill, NC
Occupation
Retired Electrical Contractor
I have rarely, if ever seen a gfci trip simple because it was defective. I would not go further than the power to the unit however my bet is on the element. Isolate that and see if it works
 
kwired

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
GerryB said:
I told this customer I could really only check the power to it. She is also a neighbor and wanted me to look. I lifted the wires at the tub panel and the breaker did not trip, 50 amp sq D gfi. So my first question is can you ever be sure a gfi breaker is good? This tub had a troubleshooting paper in it so I went a little farther. Unplugged the pump, still tripped. Unplugged the ozone whatever, still tripped. Unplugged two other things, still tripped. There was four fuses that seemed ok with continuity but I didnt' get a reading on them. My other question is do any of you guys bother with this and is it worth getting into? I have had other calls like this and there are not too many companies out there servicing these things.
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Did you check the heating element? I think just about every hot tub GFCI tripping problem I have ever encountered was usually a failing element. Also check pressure switch or other proof of flow devices as they may be the cause of the failing element.
 
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GerryB

Senior Member
Location
woodbridge, ct. USA
Dennis Alwon said:
I have rarely, if ever seen a gfci trip simple because it was defective. I would not go further than the power to the unit however my bet is on the element. Isolate that and see if it works
Click to expand...
It did say something about the heating element. The only reason I went as far as I did was because it was pretty easy to unplug these things and go try the breaker again. Like I said this was a neighbor but also a paying customer so I gave it a shot.
Dennis, thanks for the reply, which you often do and I appreciate that. I'm a little computer illiterate. I don't see replies unless I log off and then on again, and I know there must be a way to change that. windows messenger? do you know? Thanks
 
kwired

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
GerryB said:
It did say something about the heating element. The only reason I went as far as I did was because it was pretty easy to unplug these things and go try the breaker again. Like I said this was a neighbor but also a paying customer so I gave it a shot.
Dennis, thanks for the reply, which you often do and I appreciate that. I'm a little computer illiterate. I don't see replies unless I log off and then on again, and I know there must be a way to change that. windows messenger? do you know? Thanks
Click to expand...

Pull leads off the element, isolate them and then run the tub. You will still get all features of the unit except heat.

If the heater runs with no water flowing through or even just reduced water through it for any reason it has risk of damage, and is a common failure. It is the only electrical device connected directly to line power that is in direct contact with water, any damage to surface of element is going to result in ground fault current flowing through the water.
 
sparkyrick

sparkyrick

Senior Member
Location
Appleton, Wi
GerryB said:
Dennis, thanks for the reply, which you often do and I appreciate that. I'm a little computer illiterate. I don't see replies unless I log off and then on again, and I know there must be a way to change that. windows messenger? do you know? Thanks
Click to expand...

Hit F5 to refresh the page. You should now see the reply's. On my laptop I have to hold the Control key as I hit F5. Or you can right click anywhere on the page select "Refresh" or Relode" from the menu that appears.
 
kwired

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
sparkyrick said:
Hit F5 to refresh the page. You should now see the reply's. On my laptop I have to hold the Control key as I hit F5. Or you can right click anywhere on the page select "Refresh" or Relode" from the menu that appears.
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Or likely your browser has a "refresh" button somewhere near the address bar.
 
Jraef

Jraef

Moderator, OTD
Staff member
Location
San Francisco Bay Area, CA, USA
Occupation
Electrical Engineer
kw ired said:
Pull leads off the element, isolate them and then run the tub. You will still get all features of the unit except heat.

If the heater runs with no water flowing through or even just reduced water through it for any reason it has risk of damage, and is a common failure. It is the only electrical device connected directly to line power that is in direct contact with water, any damage to surface of element is going to result in ground fault current flowing through the water.
Click to expand...
Yeah, bingo. I had this happen last year on my personal hot tub, and being who I am, I decided I could replace the heater elements myself. You can order them dirt cheap over the internet, there aren't that many choices it turns out. I think I paid less than $20 for mine.

But...

It is a f()#%&!4g miserable job! I would NEVER do it again! The electrical part of it is the easy part. The plumbing part of it sucks big time... these things are made in a factory where the workers are standing up with the tub elevated so they can get to the parts by moving around underneath it, everything is dry and clean, etc. etc. When you want to replace the elements, you are on your belly, usually in the dirt, your hands can't get to where the connections were made, nothing goes back in the way it came out, then it all leaks like a sieve when you think you are done. tell her to get a spa guy to do it, this is not a purely electrical job and you will hate yourself for volunteering. Trust me.
 
G

GerryB

Senior Member
Location
woodbridge, ct. USA
Jraef said:
Yeah, bingo. I had this happen last year on my personal hot tub, and being who I am, I decided I could replace the heater elements myself. You can order them dirt cheap over the internet, there aren't that many choices it turns out. I think I paid less than $20 for mine.

But...

It is a f()#%&!4g miserable job! I would NEVER do it again! The electrical part of it is the easy part. The plumbing part of it sucks big time... these things are made in a factory where the workers are standing up with the tub elevated so they can get to the parts by moving around underneath it, everything is dry and clean, etc. etc. When you want to replace the elements, you are on your belly, usually in the dirt, your hands can't get to where the connections were made, nothing goes back in the way it came out, then it all leaks like a sieve when you think you are done. tell her to get a spa guy to do it, this is not a purely electrical job and you will hate yourself for volunteering. Trust me.
Click to expand...

That's what I thought, so my original question which Dennis answered was I want to be certain the GFI breaker is good so I can charge a service call without it coming back to me. Thanks for reply.
 
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