Arc-Flash Gloves VS Voltage Rated Gloves

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Zuper Dave

Zuper Dave

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Location
Cincinnati, OH
Arc-Flash Gloves are almost useless for manipulating tools and doing testing. And our Voltage rated gloves do not appear to be arc-flash rated. Yet I'm constantly seeing guys in arc-flash suits working in hot panels wearing Voltage rated gloves.

What gives? :?

Is this similar to wearing a Miller Fall Protection Harness, using a 3M Fall Lanyard, with an MSA attachment system?
 
G

GoldDigger

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Placerville, CA, USA
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Retired PV System Designer
Zuper Dave said:
What gives? :?
Click to expand...
In the event of an arc flash incident, only your hands will be injured (maybe even injured worse than when bare because the melted plastic holds the heat to your skin).
But you will be less likely to trigger an arc flash in the first place.
A "rock and hard place" situation.
From an OSHA perspective, they are not wearing proper PPE.
 
W

WorkSafe

Senior Member
Location
Moore, OK
70E 130.7(d) states they can wear leather gloves OR Arc-rated.

I think OSHA would first be concerned on whether or not these people are permitted to work live.
 
zog

zog

Senior Member
Location
Charlotte, NC
When the leather protectors are used over your V-rated gloves (As they should be) they provide excellent arc flash protection. They don't have a rating because that will vary based on the condition of the leather but as mentioned the 70E allows them to be used as part of your arc rated PPE.

The big issue I have with arc rated gloves is they are usually misapplied because people do not usderstand the rating system. Most arc flash labels calculated incident energy is based on a working distance of 18" (Or more), so the label may say your Ei is 9cal/cm2 (@18"). What often happens is the worker reads the label and selects AR gloves at 10 or 12 cal/cm2, but the actual working distance (Hands to energized part) may be much less than that. The Ei increases exponentally as distance decreases so the real hazard will be much much higher than the rating of the glove.
 
Zuper Dave

Zuper Dave

Member
Location
Cincinnati, OH
Yeah, but it's all about the ratings. You can "think" or "assume" that leather gloves over V-rated gloves are "excellent arc-flash protection" (assuming, again, that they aren't too old, are properly stored when not in use, in good condition, etc, etc.)

Try explaining that to an OSHA inspector and you are in a world of hurt. One not-so-insignificant bennefit of the codes to the grunt in the trenches is the ELIMINATION of grey areas. Saying something is "permitted" is always followed by exceptions and conditions. Big grey areas. :(

I'm looking for the online NFPA 70E. Found it, but haven't read it yet....
 
J

jim dungar

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Zuper Dave said:
... ELIMINATION of grey areas. Saying something is "permitted" is always followed by exceptions and conditions. Big grey areas. :(

I'm looking for the online NFPA 70E. Found it, but haven't read it yet....
Click to expand...

NFPA70E is primarily an entire grey area. It is written as 'what must be done' it does not really concern itself with 'do it this way'. This flexibility makes it very convenient for companies to use as a reference when creating Electrical Safe Work Practices programs that address their unique needs and practices. This flexibility is very detrimental when someone is looking for an 'absolute answer.
 
iwire

iwire

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Staff member
Location
Massachusetts
Zuper Dave said:
Yeah, but it's all about the ratings. You can "think" or "assume" that leather gloves over V-rated gloves are "excellent arc-flash protection"
Click to expand...

Just a note that both zog and Jim are very knowledgable people about this topic. Don't assume they are just giving you unsubstantiated opinions. :)


Welcome to the forum.
 
Zuper Dave

Zuper Dave

Member
Location
Cincinnati, OH
It wasn't my intention to "diss" anyone. But neither is it going to go well for me to tell an OSHA inspector that some guy on an internet forum said I could do it this way. I'm sure they have probably heard that one before!

HOWEVER, I did look up NFPA 70E 130.7, and assuming I am a "qualified" reader and interprester of the English language, I think you are right.

In any case, by pointing to Note #1 under Table 130.7.C.16 "Protective Clothing And PPE" of NFPA 70E that says, "(1) If rubber insulating gloves with leather protectors are required by Table 130.7(C)(15)(a) and Table 130.7.(C)(15)(b), additional leather or arc-rated gloves are not required. The combination of rubber insulating gloves with leather protectors satisfies the arc flash protection requirement."

Whether I'm right or not, the inspector will die a death of 1000 paper cuts flipping from table to table to sort it all out. :lol:

:happyno:
 
Zuper Dave

Zuper Dave

Member
Location
Cincinnati, OH
These are both written by the same guy, Hugh Hoagland.

Good stuff. :thumbsup: Especially the actual test report.

Bottom line, use voltage-rated rubber gloves with leather protectors, BUT CUT OFF THE NYLON STRAP. :slaphead:
 
zog

zog

Senior Member
Location
Charlotte, NC
Hugh does a ton of arc flash testing, known him for years, really the guru when it comes to this type of thing. He shows up here every now and then.
 
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