Inspectors rant again

[cowboyjwc]

So how is it that in 2013, I have to write up 210.4(B) on almost every service change and new panel install?

Yes I know we didn't adopt the 2008 NEC, here in CA, until 2011, but that still doens't take away the fact that it's been in the code book for 5 years.

Are other inspectors not calling it or is it just a, I'll see what I can get away with attitude? Not that the attitude one seems very cost effective.

OK I'm done.:happyyes:

 

[Dennis Alwon]

I guess it is unclear that to me whether it is required on a service change. Same thing- you do not req. afci on a service change.

That being said I see no reason not to either put ties or dp breakers

 

[cowboyjwc]

No I do not require AFCI breakers on a residential service change, but that doesn't account for the commercial/industrial guys.

 

[Ponchik]

So how is it that in 2013, I have to write up 210.4(B) on almost every service change and new panel install?
OK I'm done.:happyyes:

Do you require it on existing circuits as well? or just new circuits?

 

[xformer]

So how is it that in 2013, I have to write up 210.4(B) on almost every service change and new panel install?

excuse me for being as dense as lead on this but how exactly is the violation occurring?

 

[cowboyjwc]

Do you require it on existing circuits as well? or just new circuits?

On a service change we require it on existing circuits and of course all new circuits. I do not require it on existing circuits if the panel is existing.

excuse me for being as dense as lead on this but how exactly is the violation occurring?

Contractors just aren't doing it. I've had brand new commercial buildings where they look at me, like I had no idea what I was talking about, when I call it. On building upgrades and TI's I actually make them note it on the plans.

 

[Ponchik]

By the time CA electricians catch up with 2008 the 2011 will be enforced.

The problem is electricians and contractors think once they receive their pocket license they can forget about continuing education.

 

[cowboyjwc]

By the time CA electricians catch up with 2008 the 2011 will be enforced.

The problem is electricians and contractors think once they receive their pocket license they can forget about continuing education.

Which should be coming up in January.

 

[jumper]

I was tired, sorry....:ashamed1:......................

 

[ActionDave]

I think this may be a regional thing.

The way it is enforced for me; a panel change only changes the panel. The wires land right back on the same slots, or the same relative position. Any new circuits get handle ties. Existing circuits don't.

 

[ptonsparky]

I think this may be a regional thing.

The way it is enforced for me; a panel change only changes the panel. The wires land right back on the same slots, or the same relative position. Any new circuits get handle ties. Existing circuits don't.

I've never been called on it so I think that's the way it is in this region too. New multiwires get 2 pole or 3 pole cbs. Not sure if my wholesellers even have handle ties in stock.

 

[ActionDave]

I've never been called on it so I think that's the way it is in this region too.

I think it is a very sensible way to go, especially if there is no way to be certain which neutrals go with which hots.

 

[augie47]

By the time CA electricians catch up with 2008 the 2011 will be enforced.

The problem is electricians and contractors think once they receive their pocket license they can forget about continuing education.

That's way too common in this area also. When a new Code is adopted the inspecting agencies, often thru IAEI, hold training seminars. While a fair number attend, percentage-wise it is low. Too many of the local "electricians" depend on failed inspections as a training tool. 5 years after '08 was adopted I still run across jobs where 210.4 has been ignored. A lot of these guys work at repetitive jobs, seek no training, and are shocked whenever they encounter changes in the Code that they briefly studied in 1993

 

[kwired]

How many states do not require continuing education to renew/maintain licenses?

Most code changes are easily covered with just a few hours every year or so.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

How many states do not require continuing education to renew/maintain licenses?

Most code changes are easily covered with just a few hours every year or so.

Some states don't even require you to go to class. You could order a test online and take it with a bunch of other people. NC finally req. 4 hours classes and 4 hours online or 8 hours classes.

 

[kwired]

Some states don't even require you to go to class. You could order a test online and take it with a bunch of other people. NC finally req. 4 hours classes and 4 hours online or 8 hours classes.

Here licenses expire Dec 31 of even numbered years. That means renewal is necessary every two years. In order to renew you must have 12 hours of continuing education (during the two period of the license being renewed). Six of those hours must be code related content. The remaining six can be any board approved topic. 12 hours is not all that many hours over two years, going to a code class that primarily focuses on changes in a new edition of code usually takes up the majority of the twelve hours easily. We are now in a new two year license cycle, but I will likely wait until late this year of next year to take any classes as there will not be much classes until then that focus on 2014 NEC.

 

[RICK NAPIER]

Here licenses are 3 years with 34 CEU hours required. 9 hours on code changes, 1 hour business law and the remainder on board approved classes.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

I usually end up with 18 credit hours every year. Unfortunately we can only acquire up to 3 years in advance so most of my hours are not usable.

 

[George Stolz]

Many people are aware of the changes, but test to see if it will be enforced. That strikes me as a sorry way to operate. We adopt the code fairly quickly in CO, but sometimes people roll their eyes when you tell them they need to buy handle ties, and often try to skate by without.

 

[kwired]

Here licenses are 3 years with 34 CEU hours required. 9 hours on code changes, 1 hour business law and the remainder on board approved classes.

Business law is not a bad idea, for contractor license holders, seems pointless for journeyman license holders. Maybe you were only referring to contractors?