hillelect
New member
- Location
- st. Joseph, MI
does a control panel, assembled with UL listed parts, have to have a UL label according to the national electrical code
UL listing
- Thread starter hillelect
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Gregg Harris
Senior Member
- Location
- Virginia
- Occupation
- Electrical,HVAC, Technical Trainer
Listed. Equipment, materials, or services included in a list published by an organization that is acceptable to the authority having jurisdiction and concerned with evaluation of products or services, that maintains periodic inspection of production of listed equipment or materials or periodic evaluation of services, and whose listing states that either the equipment, material, or service meets appropriate designated standards or has been tested and found suitable for a specified purpose.
Informational Note: The means for identifying listed equipment may vary for each organization concerned with product evaluation, some of which do not recognize equipment as listed unless it is also labeled. Use of the system employed by the listing organization allows the authority having jurisdiction to identify a listed product.
- Location
- Placerville, CA, USA
- Occupation
- Retired PV System Designer
And allows the listing organization to collect more fees for the right to print the label.
petersonra
Senior Member
- Location
- Northern illinois
- Occupation
- engineer
The direct answer is that the NEC does not require industrial control panels be listed.
- Location
- Logan, Utah
Correct, Article 409 addresses industrial control panels and does not require the industrial control panel to be listed.
Chris
- Location
- San Francisco Bay Area, CA, USA
- Occupation
- Electrical Engineer
Well, article 409 would almost beg to differ.
TECHNICALLY, it does not "require" that it be listed, but you would have to follow all of the provisions of article 409, OR use a listed assembly. In 409, it requires you to perform a determination of the SCCR, Short Circuit Current Rating, of an industrial control panel that has any power devices in it and for lack of a better standard, they point you to UL-508A, Supplement SB-1 as the suggested method of attaining it.
But LOCAL codes usually are where the "listing" requirement is typically added anyway. So for instance here in California, the California Electric Code states that it adopts the 2011 NEC in its entirety, plus adds the following provisions... then goes on to eventually require NRTL* listing of assemblies of more than 2 components in an enclosure, not counting the enclosure. Something like that (don't have it here with me, going by failing memory here). That's the way is is in all states west of the Rockies and as far as I know, about 75% of states nation wide, but technically, not all states.
*NRTL = Nationally Recognized Testing Laboratory, of which UL is the most widely known of the bunch. But it is not the only one, and I don't believe that any state expressly requires that the NRTL be UL only. Most reference the "official" list of NRTLs provided by OSHA.
http://www.osha.gov/dts/otpca/nrtl/
petersonra
Senior Member
- Location
- Northern illinois
- Occupation
- engineer
I would add that the UL508a supplement that tells you how to determine the SCCR of an industrial control panel requires you to follow all the rest of the standard so you might as well list it, even if technically you might not have to.
Oddly, I have never noticed a requirement in UL508a that the actual UL sticker has to be applied.
Oddly, I have never noticed a requirement in UL508a that the actual UL sticker has to be applied.
- Location
- Mission Viejo, CA
- Occupation
- Professional Electrical Engineer
The NEC is not the last word here.
Michigan has a FedOSHA certified ?State Plan?; however, it has never received ?Final Approval?. That means FedOSHA continues to look over their shoulder and any discrepancy between Michigan and Federal OSHA reverts to federal jurisdiction.
In FedOSHA?s definition of Acceptable, if something can be NRTL certified, it must be.
The UL ?White Book? notes how they confirm certification of various products.
Michigan has a FedOSHA certified ?State Plan?; however, it has never received ?Final Approval?. That means FedOSHA continues to look over their shoulder and any discrepancy between Michigan and Federal OSHA reverts to federal jurisdiction.
In FedOSHA?s definition of Acceptable, if something can be NRTL certified, it must be.
The UL ?White Book? notes how they confirm certification of various products.
Aleman
Senior Member
- Location
- Southern Ca, USA
I don't think the NEC requires a listing. But your local gov't might require a listing. I have been building panels for our new building under construction last 3 weeks. We have to get these listed,
along with panels that came with new equipment being installed. This per the city code. We can't occupy the new building unless we meet this requirement. We are getting listed by TUV SUD
which is a listing/inspection service that goes by NEC and UL508A codes.
But if I am building panels for our existing building, then we are not required to have these inspected or listed. But we build them to UL508A anyhow. And might get them listed eventually.
along with panels that came with new equipment being installed. This per the city code. We can't occupy the new building unless we meet this requirement. We are getting listed by TUV SUD
which is a listing/inspection service that goes by NEC and UL508A codes.
But if I am building panels for our existing building, then we are not required to have these inspected or listed. But we build them to UL508A anyhow. And might get them listed eventually.
- Location
- San Francisco Bay Area, CA, USA
- Occupation
- Electrical Engineer
Another possible reason to get them listed may be in your facility's fire insurance policy. Sometimes the insurer will require NRTL listing and may even have a rider that says if a fire is determined to be caused by unlisted equipment that should have been listed, the coverage is reduced or even void! I see that a lot here in California.
Remember, UL stands for Underwriters Laboratories, as in INSURANCE underwriters. That was the original purpose behind the founding of it, so that insurers had a way of protecting themselves against losses caused by people using things in ways that were not always safe.
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