150 amp service in nyc

[maz2300]

I have a 150 amp service in nyc residential and overhead. It was installed using 1 1/4 rigid gal. My questions are...1- do I need an insulated neutral kit for the meter pan
2- do I bond the the threaded nippke connecting the meterpan to main breaker panel using bonding bushings
3- if using insulated neutral kit do I put the ground rod wire and cold water bond to a seperate ground bsr in panel and keep neutrals seperate

 

[PowerSupportElec]

What exactly are you doing? Replacing the panel but leaving the service riser?
As for what you should have in the meter pan, that is entirely up to the PoCo.
If you use a metallic nipple, then yes you have t bond it. That's why I try to use PVC whenever possible.
If you did what you explained in #3, where would your main bonding jumper be? Would neutral be bonded to ground at all in that setup?

 

[Dennis Alwon]

The rigid riser should be bonded thru the hub on the meter base so you don't need to worry about that.

What is an insulated neutral kit? The neutral in the meter and the main service panel must be bonded to the cans. If you have a metallic pipe between the meter and the main panel then you need to bond the conduit.

 

[maz2300]

I'm replacing a service. The meter pan came with an insulated neutral kit that bolts into the normal neutral spot on the meter pan. It makes the the neutral lugs isolated from the casing on the meter pan. Wasent sure if if was a city code thing. Not sure if I even need it. And the metal nipple between the meter pan and panel needs bonding bushings? Wouldn't it already be bonded through the metal nipple an locknuts

 

[Dennis Alwon]

I'm replacing a service. The meter pan came with an insulated neutral kit that bolts into the normal neutral spot on the meter pan. It makes the the neutral lugs isolated from the casing on the meter pan. Wasent sure if if was a city code thing. Not sure if I even need it. And the metal nipple between the meter pan and panel needs bonding bushings? Wouldn't it already be bonded through the metal nipple an locknuts

The NEC does not trust the bonding to be done with a simple locknut on metal pipe.

If there is a separate isolated neutral kit then I don't know what to tell you. I have never seen it like that for a service unless the disconnect is ahead of the meter

 

[PowerSupportElec]

I'm replacing a service. The meter pan came with an insulated neutral kit that bolts into the normal neutral spot on the meter pan. It makes the the neutral lugs isolated from the casing on the meter pan. Wasent sure if if was a city code thing. Not sure if I even need it. Did you get this meter from the PoCo or just pick it up at a supply house?

You need to see what your power company wants. I can't imagine that they would want an isolated neutral, but NYC makes stupid decisions all the time.

And the metal nipple between the meter pan and panel needs bonding bushings? Wouldn't it already be bonded through the metal nipple an locknuts

See 250.92.

 

[texie]

I'm replacing a service. The meter pan came with an insulated neutral kit that bolts into the normal neutral spot on the meter pan. It makes the the neutral lugs isolated from the casing on the meter pan. Wasent sure if if was a city code thing. Not sure if I even need it. And the metal nipple between the meter pan and panel needs bonding bushings? Wouldn't it already be bonded through the metal nipple an locknuts

If you have a metallic nipple between the meter and the disco. it needs to be bonded per 250.92. In your case, since you have a meter can with an isolated neutral you will have to bond both ends of the nipple so the meter can is bonded. Make sure to bond the neutral bar in the main disconnect. I'm seeing more of these meter cans with an isolated neutral and this is something that needs to be watched for. Until recently you had a hard time finding a meter can with an isolated neutral when you needed one. They seem to be getting more commonly available for use in solar metering and such where you don't want a bonded neutral.

 

[PowerSupportElec]

In your case, since you have a meter can with an isolated neutral you will have to bond both ends of the nipple so the meter can is bonded.

Who says that he actually needs the isolated neutral? That's why I am trying to determine where he got that meter pan from and what his PoCo requires.

 

[texie]

Who says that he actually needs the isolated neutral? That's why I am trying to determine where he got that meter pan from and what his PoCo requires.

I'm not saying he needs an isolated neutral. That's just he seems to have. The meter can has to be bonded-period. I'm just saying that with the advent of meter cans available with isolated neutrals it is something to be watched for when using for service entrances and you have to bond them in that case.

 

[darekelec]

hey, man.
I'm also in nyc. keep neutral bonded to can. same in service disconnect. bond nipple to neutral using migb bushings. on one side is sufficient but some guys like it on both sides. conduit from overhead bonds to can with hub. from neutral in service disconnect you go to water pipe and ground rod (nyc thing).
are you gonna install a new mast? it has to be threaded conduit in nyc
are you gonna have only 1 service disconnect?

 

[infinity]

he meter pan came with an insulated neutral kit that bolts into the normal neutral spot on the meter pan. It makes the the neutral lugs isolated from the casing on the meter pan.

Can you post some photo's of this meter pan or provide a part number?

 

[maz2300]

Yes new mast. I always worked on long island and we alway left the neutral jumper bonded to to the can as it came that way. This meter came with the insulated neutral kit so wasent sure if I needed it in nyc as I ordered a nyc approved meter pan.

 

[darekelec]

from NYC amendments
ARTICLE 338
Service-Entrance Cable: Types SE and USE
SECTION 338.10
Subsection 338.10(A) ? Add a second sentence to read as follows:
Where installed as service entrance conductors, Type SE cable shall be enclosed in a threaded metallicconduit.
Subsection 338.10(B)(2) ? Delete the Exception in its entirety.Subsection 338.10(B)(4)(b) ? Revise to read as follows:
(b) Exterior Installations. In addition to the provisions of this article, service-entrance cableused for feeders or branch circuits, where installed as exterior wiring, shall be installed in athreaded metallic conduit.

Would you guys agree that nyc wants the mast to be of threaded conduit? no compresion couplings?

 

[Dennis Alwon]

from NYC amendments
ARTICLE 338
Service-Entrance Cable: Types SE and USE
SECTION 338.10
Subsection 338.10(A) ? Add a second sentence to read as follows:
Where installed as service entrance conductors, Type SE cable shall be enclosed in a threaded metallicconduit.
Subsection 338.10(B)(2) ? Delete the Exception in its entirety.Subsection 338.10(B)(4)(b) ? Revise to read as follows:
(b) Exterior Installations. In addition to the provisions of this article, service-entrance cableused for feeders or branch circuits, where installed as exterior wiring, shall be installed in athreaded metallic conduit.

Would you guys agree that nyc wants the mast to be of threaded conduit? no compresion couplings?

That is what it sounds like to me. Threaded Aluminum , IMC or RMC would be what is expected

 

[maz2300]

The meter pan is milbank u3042-xl-qg-blg-li and the insulated neutral kit is catolog# k1047

 

[texie]

The meter pan is milbank u3042-xl-qg-blg-li and the insulated neutral kit is catolog# k1047

As I recall that meter can has a standard bonded neutral. If you need an isolated neutral you use the kit you described and abandon the standard bonded neutral. Since you are using this as service equipment, don't use the neutral kit. As I said in my earlier post, isolated neutral meter cans are becoming more common for uses other than services. Some manufacturers are doing like a panel board with a bonding screw so you can do it isolated or bonded with the same part number meter can and no extra parts. Milbank, as you have, has chosen to make a kit available to achieve this. But as I said, you don't use this in a service entrance application.

 

[contactm]

Since you are under com edison You clearly need to take the isolated neutral kit out and replace it with a bonded one unless you are after the service switch