2005 NEC 680.25

[marcelo]

Good morning Gentleman,

Here is the picture: An existing 200A service with a meter pan/200A breaker disconnect combination feeding a Main Panel in the garage thru a 4/0 SER cable. This garage main panel feeds another existing outdoor sub-panel that feeds the existing swimming pool equipment. Here comes the trick part!
We installed a new 20KW generator and switched the whole house with a new 200A transfer switch mounted outside right next to the meter pan, the SER cable in the meter pan was re-routed to the transfer switch.
The inspector failed the job because he is claiming 680.25 and he's telling me the 4/0 SER needs to me removed and a raceway needs to be installed between the transfer switch and the garage main panel.
I'm questioning because the garage main panel is not the swimming pool panel, it's feeding the rest of the house also and we didn't touch anything related to the pool.
Your comments will be greatly appreciated...

Thank You,

Marcelo Zanetti

 

[don_resqcapt19]

It appears that the 4/0 SER is a feeder on the supply side of the pool panel and is covered by the rule in 680.25.

 

[marcelo]

2005 NEC 680.25

It appears that the 4/0 SER is a feeder on the supply side of the pool panel and is covered by the rule in 680.25.

Hi Don,

Thanks for your reply, actually the 4/0 SER is on the supply side of the Main Panel located in the garage. This Main Panel in the garage them supplies the Pool Panel thru an existing feeder that was untouched.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

The rule covers all feeders on the supply side of the pool equipment panel, not just the one directly connected to the pool panel. The rule starts at the 200 amp breaker at the meter and runs to the pool panel no matter how many panels may be between the service disconnect and the pool panel.

 

[GoldDigger]

It appears that the 4/0 SER is a feeder on the supply side of the pool panel and is covered by the rule in 680.25.

Does the Code language "...to any feeder on the supply side of panelboards supplying branch circuits for pool equipment ..."
mean any feeder which is in the path from service or SDS to pool panel (sensible) or taken more literally does it include any feeder which is connected anywhere on the supply side of the pool branch circuits in parallel with the lines that actually feed the pool circuits, but not actually feeding a pool circuit?

 

[don_resqcapt19]

Does the Code language "...to any feeder on the supply side of panelboards supplying branch circuits for pool equipment ..."
mean any feeder which is in the path from service or SDS to pool panel (sensible) or taken more literally does it include any feeder which is connected anywhere on the supply side of the pool branch circuits in parallel with the lines that actually feed the pool circuits, but not actually feeding a pool circuit?

Good, question, in my opinion the rule only applies to feeders that actually supply current to the pool panel, not to other feeders fed from the same service, but the code wording in not 100% clear.

680.25 Feeders. These provisions shall apply to any feeder on the supply side of panelboards supplying branch circuits for pool equipment ...

 

[kingpb]

It appears the AHJ is having you correct what he perceives as a deficiency in the original installation, because the generator and transfer switch themselves have nothing to do with what was done before. However, because you are modifying a system that does inherently feed the pool equipment panel, the inspector can make you bring the system involved up to code, or at least his interpretation of it.

It is unlikely you will be able to formulate a rebuttal to his correction notice that is going to satisfy him enough to change his mind. Instead I would focus on working with the homeowner to get them to realize this is additional work not covered by the original scope. In other words a Change Order. Do not do the work first, expecting to get paid.

I personally think 680.25 does apply, and the original install needs to be corrected.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

It appears the AHJ is having you correct what he perceives as a deficiency in the original installation, because the generator and transfer switch themselves have nothing to do with what was done before. However, because you are modifying a system that does inherently feed the pool equipment panel, the inspector can make you bring the system involved up to code, or at least his interpretation of it.

It is unlikely you will be able to formulate a rebuttal to his correction notice that is going to satisfy him enough to change his mind. Instead I would focus on working with the homeowner to get them to realize this is additional work not covered by the original scope. In other words a Change Order. Do not do the work first, expecting to get paid.

I personally think 680.25 does apply, and the original install needs to be corrected.

It appears to me that the AHJ is only looking for the new work to comply with the code. A new feeder was installed using a cable wiring method, where the code requires a raceway wiring method. In my opinion the new work needs to be corrected at the contractors expense.

I am not convinced that the AHJ has the authority to require corrections to the existing wiring that was not physically touched by the current project. In my town, he would not have that authority.