Lights work on back up source not utility... :/

[bgelectric]

So im working in a new building, I wired up lights in halls to bz-50 pp and motions in halls. They worked fine until we tested the genset.
Now they only work when the circuit is backed up by the genset not utility power???
When utility power is on the motions leds are on detecting motion but do not turn on the lights...
When the lights are running off the genset they work as they should:?

 

[Volta]

Yup, sounds strange. Do you suppose that the genset voltage is noticeably higher that utility? I wonder if the units no longer see the motion inputs at the minimum threshold when on utility, due to a higher threshold being 'burned-in' by the higher standby power... :blink:

 

[bgelectric]

I measured the voltage and it was not noticeably higher.
Why would the power pack work off utility and then only off the genset...?

 

[petersonra]

I measured the voltage and it was not noticeably higher.
Why would the power pack work off utility and then only off the genset...?

are you sure the power pack is actually getting power from the utility? did you check for the correct voltage right at the unit? check L-L (if this exists), L-N and N-G right at the unit when it is on utility power.

 

[bgelectric]

are you sure the power pack is actually getting power from the utility? did you check for the correct voltage right at the unit? check L-L (if this exists), L-N and N-G right at the unit when it is on utility power.

Yes it is. The leds on the motions light up and blink when motion is detected.

 

[Smart $]

Yes it is. The leds on the motions light up and blink when motion is detected.

That indicates the motions are getting power, but does not verify the output, nor that the pp is switching. You have to check the motions control output and the pp load switch.

 

[kwired]

Yup, sounds strange. Do you suppose that the genset voltage is noticeably higher that utility? I wonder if the units no longer see the motion inputs at the minimum threshold when on utility, due to a higher threshold being 'burned-in' by the higher standby power... :blink:

I am thinking same thing. If they are 120-277 input ballasts and the generator voltage was significantly high enough they may no longer work on whatever utility voltage actually is and are looking for a higher input.

My understanding on many of these ballasts is once they have been used on the high voltage end of the range they will no longer work on the low voltage end of the range.

 

[LEO2854]

I am thinking same thing. If they are 120-277 input ballasts and the generator voltage was significantly high enough they may no longer work on whatever utility voltage actually is and are looking for a higher input.

My understanding on many of these ballasts is once they have been used on the high voltage end of the range they will no longer work on the low voltage end of the range.

I've heard that too, but I have not seen it yet.

Why would the gen set be set at 277 but the utility is only 120 volts?:blink:

 

[kwired]

I've heard that too, but I have not seen it yet.

Why would the gen set be set at 277 but the utility is only 120 volts?:blink:

I didn't mean that 277 was applied, maybe something like 135 - 150 was applied and now these ballasts don't work on nominal 120 anymore.

 

[Little Bill]

I am thinking same thing. If they are 120-277 input ballasts and the generator voltage was significantly high enough they may no longer work on whatever utility voltage actually is and are looking for a higher input.

My understanding on many of these ballasts is once they have been used on the high voltage end of the range they will no longer work on the low voltage end of the range.

I didn't mean that 277 was applied, maybe something like 135 - 150 was applied and now these ballasts don't work on nominal 120 anymore.

You could verify this by checking the voltage at the power leads to the ballast from both the genny and utility. If you feel this is the case of a higher voltage "burning" in the ballast, then you could try another ballast with utility only and see if the lights work.

If you want to take a chance and ruin another ballast, you could then run it on the genny, then try again with utility power.

 

[Smart $]

You could verify this by checking the voltage at the power leads to the ballast from both the genny and utility. If you feel this is the case of a higher voltage "burning" in the ballast, then you could try another ballast with utility only and see if the lights work.

If you want to take a chance and ruin another ballast, you could then run it on the genny, then try again with utility power.

I don't believe ballast is the proper term here. They are called power packs. The only thing the truly power is the 24V sensor and the internal relay

 

[bgelectric]

I don't believe ballast is the proper term here. They are called power packs. The only thing the truly power is the 24V sensor and the internal relay

I agree its the power pack not the ballasts that are the issue.
Both utility and genset provide 120v not 277.

 

[Little Bill]

I am thinking same thing. If they are 120-277 input ballasts and the generator voltage was significantly high enough they may no longer work on whatever utility voltage actually is and are looking for a higher input.

My understanding on many of these ballasts is once they have been used on the high voltage end of the range they will no longer work on the low voltage end of the range.

I've heard that too, but I have not seen it yet.

Why would the gen set be set at 277 but the utility is only 120 volts?:blink:

I didn't mean that 277 was applied, maybe something like 135 - 150 was applied and now these ballasts don't work on nominal 120 anymore.

You could verify this by checking the voltage at the power leads to the ballast from both the genny and utility. If you feel this is the case of a higher voltage "burning" in the ballast, then you could try another ballast with utility only and see if the lights work.

If you want to take a chance and ruin another ballast, you could then run it on the genny, then try again with utility power.

I don't believe ballast is the proper term here. They are called power packs. The only thing the truly power is the 24V sensor and the internal relay

I was only going by what was said before me!
Why didn't they get a "spanking"?

 

[kwired]

I don't believe ballast is the proper term here. They are called power packs. The only thing the truly power is the 24V sensor and the internal relay

OK I wasn't quite following what OP had there. I did look up the BZ-50 and it is also a 120-277 volt supplied unit and possibly could still have a similar problem if generator voltage was too high.

 

[Smart $]

I don't believe ballast is the proper term here. They are called power packs. The only thing the truly power is the 24V sensor and the internal relay

I was only going by what was said before me!
Why didn't they get a "spanking"?

Spank 'em all...!!! :lol:

 

[bgelectric]

OK I wasn't quite following what OP had there. I did look up the BZ-50 and it is also a 120-277 volt supplied unit and possibly could still have a similar problem if generator voltage was too high.

To give a little more detail.
I have 4 PP doing the same thing. All on the same circuit all on different levels.
I dont see why 120-277 range would matter since it should be able to work within the 120-277v range. Not at the highest volts applied within its range and no longer be capable of operating at lower voltage....

 

[Volta]

Well, the motions at 24 volts may be more sensitive than the power packs themselves. I would assume the PPs regulate the output voltage within each input range, but if not, or not well, perhaps the problem might be the outputs of the motions now when on utility power rather than the receiving inputs of the PPs.

 

[Smart $]

To give a little more detail.
I have 4 PP doing the same thing. All on the same circuit all on different levels.
I dont see why 120-277 range would matter since it should be able to work within the 120-277v range. Not at the highest volts applied within its range and no longer be capable of operating at lower voltage....

We can continue to speculate or you can take some measurements...???

PP LV out to motions (Blk-Red) = ?
Motions control out to PP (Blk-Blu), motion = ?, no motion = ?
PP switching (Hot-Load), motion = ?, no motion = ?

Measurements on utility and if possible repeat on backup.

 

[zbang]

Does everything else work properly on both utility and generator power?

I'm sure I don't understanding the entire setup, like where the transfer switch is and what other circuits are involved, but when the circuit is on utility power, it it actually getting real power? Say, enough to operate a 500w lamp? I'm thinking that there may be enough induced voltage to operate the motion detector(s) but not actually light the lamps.

This is, of course, pretty much a WAG .

 

[kwired]

We can continue to speculate or you can take some measurements...???

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