permanent stairs to attic - AFCI required?

Status
Not open for further replies.

mek421

Member
Location
Upstate NY, USA
There have been a few threads about motors tripping AFCI devices recently. My reading of code seems to be that simple over current protection is sufficient for an attic. If a permanent stairway leads only to an attic, is it acceptable for a receptacle to be installed at the bottom of the stairs for use as a vacuum cleaner receptacle? (The attic has a ceiling height less than 6' at the peak of the roof.)

I'm in NY, this is the relevant portion of residential code:

E3802.11 Arc-fault circuit-interrupter protection. All branch circuits that supply 120-volt, single-phase, 15- and 20-ampere outlets installed in family rooms, dining rooms, living rooms, parlors, libraries, dens, bedrooms, sunrooms, recreations rooms, closets, hallways and similar rooms or areas shall be protected by a combination type arc-fault circuit interrupter installed to provide protection of the branch circuit.
 

Gregg Harris

Senior Member
Location
Virginia
Occupation
Electrical,HVAC, Technical Trainer
There have been a few threads about motors tripping AFCI devices recently. My reading of code seems to be that simple over current protection is sufficient for an attic. If a permanent stairway leads only to an attic, is it acceptable for a receptacle to be installed at the bottom of the stairs for use as a vacuum cleaner receptacle? (The attic has a ceiling height less than 6' at the peak of the roof.)

I'm in NY, this is the relevant portion of residential code:

You have the correct article, and it does apply to your scenario. Required
 

Volta

Senior Member
Location
Columbus, Ohio
I suppose you have to define / describe "at the bottom of the stairs" better to be certain. In the attic itself, I would say not required. In the stairwell itself, maybe but not necessarily. If the bottom end of the stairs are in a hallway, yes. In a bathroom, no.
 

mek421

Member
Location
Upstate NY, USA
I suppose you have to define / describe "at the bottom of the stairs" better to be certain. In the attic itself, I would say not required. In the stairwell itself, maybe but not necessarily. If the bottom end of the stairs are in a hallway, yes. In a bathroom, no.

If I start in the attic, I walk down the stairs and end on a landing with a door from the landing (to the left after coming down the stairs from said attic) to a bedroom. The stairs themselves are directly above stairs to the basement. The bedroom that the door to the stairway is on, that wall is the only interior wall for the stairway - all the rest of the walls are exterior walls. Not sure if this last makes any difference and I don't know how to explain better in words.

Mr. Harris - I looked in definitions and was unable to determine that stairs, especially to a non-habitable space, were "similar" to a hallway. If you have a source for your opinion that AFCI is required in my scenario, please let me know.
 

GoldDigger

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Placerville, CA, USA
Occupation
Retired PV System Designer
If I start in the attic, I walk down the stairs and end on a landing with a door from the landing (to the left after coming down the stairs from said attic) to a bedroom. The stairs themselves are directly above stairs to the basement. The bedroom that the door to the stairway is on, that wall is the only interior wall for the stairway - all the rest of the walls are exterior walls. Not sure if this last makes any difference and I don't know how to explain better in words.

Mr. Harris - I looked in definitions and was unable to determine that stairs, especially to a non-habitable space, were "similar" to a hallway. If you have a source for your opinion that AFCI is required in my scenario, please let me know.

A landing at the top of the lower set of stairs which leads both to the stairs and to a bedroom door looks to me like part of a hallway. The stairs themselves, probably not. But I am not used to seeing receptacle outlets on stairs. Seems like a generally bad idea to plug a cord in there.
And the attic might be close enough to a closet that IF you put a receptacle there at all it would need to be AFCI. Is there anything in the attic like a furnace or other air handler that would require a convenience receptacle?
However, don't forget that the attic lighting outlet would still require an AFCI circuit even if there were no receptacles.
Easiest to get a better vacuum cleaner or an EMI filter to put in series with the cord. :)
 

Volta

Senior Member
Location
Columbus, Ohio
If I start in the attic, I walk down the stairs and end on a landing with a door from the landing (to the left after coming down the stairs from said attic) to a bedroom. The stairs themselves are directly above stairs to the basement. The bedroom that the door to the stairway is on, that wall is the only interior wall for the stairway - all the rest of the walls are exterior walls. Not sure if this last makes any difference and I don't know how to explain better in words.
...
Do you mean the stairway is almost like an enclosed fire escape, basically outside of the main floorplan?
Does the landing only open to the bedroom?

A landing at the top of the lower set of stairs which leads both to the stairs and to a bedroom door looks to me like part of a hallway. The stairs themselves, probably not. But I am not used to seeing receptacle outlets on stairs. Seems like a generally bad idea to plug a cord in there.
And the attic might be close enough to a closet that IF you put a receptacle there at all it would need to be AFCI. Is there anything in the attic like a furnace or other air handler that would require a convenience receptacle?
However, don't forget that the attic lighting outlet would still require an AFCI circuit even if there were no receptacles.
Easiest to get a better vacuum cleaner or an EMI filter to put in series with the cord. :)
Is that true? If it is not used as a living space, what room type would you consider it similar too?
 

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
A landing at the top of the lower set of stairs which leads both to the stairs and to a bedroom door looks to me like part of a hallway. The stairs themselves, probably not. But I am not used to seeing receptacle outlets on stairs. Seems like a generally bad idea to plug a cord in there.
And the attic might be close enough to a closet that IF you put a receptacle there at all it would need to be AFCI. Is there anything in the attic like a furnace or other air handler that would require a convenience receptacle?
However, don't forget that the attic lighting outlet would still require an AFCI circuit even if there were no receptacles.
Easiest to get a better vacuum cleaner or an EMI filter to put in series with the cord. :)

Do you mean the stairway is almost like an enclosed fire escape, basically outside of the main floorplan?
Does the landing only open to the bedroom?


Is that true? If it is not used as a living space, what room type would you consider it similar too?
The landing as well as the stairway are to me both similar to a hallway or corridor.

It may not be common to see receptacles along stairway walls, but is not prohibited. It is more common to see receptacles at landings of stairways, and according to some women that like to decorate, it is a requirement:happyyes:

The way I see the OP's installation is that he has a door in a bedroom that opens to an unfinished space. The unfinished space happens to have stairs right at the entry to that space. The stairs are part of the unfinished space, if the door were at the top of the stairs, then it may be debatable as to whether the stairs are a part of the unfinished space.
 

mek421

Member
Location
Upstate NY, USA
There is no door from the stairs to the attic and I may have technically misused the word landing in my description. From the bedroom, a door is opened and there is a square space big enough for someone to comfortably make the right turn needed to go up the stairs to the attic. The door from bedroom to staircase is the only egress from the bottom of the stairs.

I hope I'm not causing drama with this apparently not so simple question.
 

Volta

Senior Member
Location
Columbus, Ohio
It does not seem to me then to be a continuation of the living space, nor a connecting path between two otherwise finished living spaces. From this description I would not expect to be required to provide AFCI protection for outlets in that area.

That said, from the first post it seems like the intent is to provide a means to use a portable vacuum cleaner at the lower end of the stairs, which might then make a good case for the use of an AFCI breaker, but that seems to be more about design that my strict interpretation of the NEC.
 

GoldDigger

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Placerville, CA, USA
Occupation
Retired PV System Designer
It does not seem to me then to be a continuation of the living space, nor a connecting path between two otherwise finished living spaces. From this description I would not expect to be required to provide AFCI protection for outlets in that area.

That said, from the first post it seems like the intent is to provide a means to use a portable vacuum cleaner at the lower end of the stairs, which might then make a good case for the use of an AFCI breaker, but that seems to be more about design that my strict interpretation of the NEC.
Actually, what I read from the same post was that the intent was to use a vacuum cleaner in the attic, but to power it from an non-AFCI receptacle to avoid problems.
If you are going to regularly vacuum the attic, it adds to the presumption that it is living space, at least similar to a closet.
 

Volta

Senior Member
Location
Columbus, Ohio
Actually, what I read from the same post was that the intent was to use a vacuum cleaner in the attic, but to power it from an non-AFCI receptacle to avoid problems.
If you are going to regularly vacuum the attic, it adds to the presumption that it is living space, at least similar to a closet.

Perhaps, although with the cord lengths I've seen on most vacuum cleaners, it is hard to see the bottom of the stairs as a good location for a receptacle for an appliance used in the attic.
 

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
OP mentioned it was the intent to use this for vacuum, and the vacuum has a pretty long cord so it would reach most areas from this receptacle.

I don't really see how an inspector can reject this. If 210.52 compliant receptacles are installed in the rest of the house then the occupant has plenty of places to plug in this vacuum. What is preventing them from running an extension cord to some other place (basement, garage, bath, outdoors, neighbors house...) to use the vacuum if they decide to do so?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top