Receptacle Tester - Multiple "Hots"

[dinos]

I had a situation where a mis-wired 3PH/5W cord connector (the neutral was swapped with one of the phases) resulted in 208V between the phase and neutral slots in a 1PH/3W (i.e. Phase, Neutral and Ground slots) receptacle.

Most of the receptacle testers I've seen (such as the Ideal 61-500) seem to say they are rated for ~120V circuits...I have not found a specification sheet that says what voltage they can actually safely handle.

I know that these testers are not designed to test for "multiple hots" per se, but is it safe or could they be damaged when plugging into a receptacle that is operating on 208V as described?

 

[LEO2854]

I had a situation where a mis-wired 3PH/5W cord connector (the neutral was swapped with one of the phases) resulted in 208V between the phase and neutral slots in a 1PH/3W (i.e. Phase, Neutral and Ground slots) receptacle.

Most of the receptacle testers I've seen (such as the Ideal 61-500) seem to say they are rated for ~120V circuits...I have not found a specification sheet that says what voltage they can actually safely handle.

I know that these testers are not designed to test for "multiple hots" per se, but is it safe or could they be damaged when plugging into a receptacle that is operating on 208V as described?

It says the voltage right on ideals web page.


http://www.idealindustries.com/products/test_measurement/electrical_testers/receptable_testers.jsp

I don't see how you can use it in this application however.

 

[dinos]

It says the voltage right on ideals web page.


http://www.idealindustries.com/products/test_measurement/electrical_testers/receptable_testers.jsp

I don't see how you can use it in this application however.

And therein lies the rub...if I don't use a multi-meter ahead of time and am routinely plugging in the receptacle tester to unverified circuits the chance exists that a receptacle has 208 on it.

I thought perhaps that while it is designed for 125V circuits in terms of its diagnostic functions, that it might be rated for 240V or some such voltage because of this possibility.

 

[GoldDigger]

And therein lies the rub...if I don't use a multi-meter ahead of time and am routinely plugging in the receptacle tester to unverified circuits the chance exists that a receptacle has 208 on it.

I thought perhaps that while it is designed for 125V circuits in terms of its diagnostic functions, that it might be rated for 240V or some such voltage because of this possibility.

Let me recap that:
The tester will detect wiring problems in 125 volt receptacles, unless they are miswired? :slaphead:

 

[dinos]

Let me recap that:
The tester will detect wiring problems in 125 volt receptacles, unless they are miswired? :slaphead:

Aint that a kicker?

I am wondering what it would indicate via its LEDs...if it survived the 208V applied voltage in the first place.

 

[roger]

How are you using one of the analyzers shown on a 5 wire receptacle?

Roger

 

[dinos]

How are you using one of the analyzers shown on a 5 wire receptacle?

Roger

We have a multi-outlet assembly that is fed from a 3-phase/5-wire cord (208/120V source), but the MOA itself only contains single phase receptacles.

 

[K8MHZ]

Let me recap that:
The tester will detect wiring problems in 125 volt receptacles, unless they are miswired? :slaphead:

A jumper between the grounded and grounding terminals on a receptacle, for instance. Also, if you have a reversed hot and neutral on a two wire feed, along with a jumpered grounded / grounding terminal, the tester will read that all is OK.

 

[roger]

We have a multi-outlet assembly that is fed from a 3-phase/5-wire cord (208/120V source), but the MOA itself only contains single phase receptacles.

So who wired these assemblies? I think that is the problem that needs to be addressed. Many a tester has been destroyed being used on something that was improperly wired and unfortunately that will continue although testers are better at protecting themselves than they used to be.

To answer your original question, your tester will probably be damaged.

Roger

 

[K8MHZ]

So who wired these assemblies? I think that is the problem that needs to be addressed. Many a tester has been destroyed being used on something that was improperly wired and unfortunately that will continue although testers are better at protecting themselves than they used to be.

To answer your original question, your tester will probably be damaged.

Roger

I think the tester being destroyed should be a lesser concern that what would have happened if a 120 volt load was plugged in.

A solenoid tester is the best answer. The plug in testers are not rated for every voltage that could be present due to miswiring. A solenoid tester pretty much will be.

 

[dinos]

So who wired these assemblies? I think that is the problem that needs to be addressed. Many a tester has been destroyed being used on something that was improperly wired and unfortunately that will continue although testers are better at protecting themselves than they used to be.

To answer your original question, your tester will probably be damaged.

Roger

We are investigating who did the wiring.

I am presently trying to contact the mfr of one of these testers to see what they have to say about how their tester would react to this unusual condition.

 

[roger]

I think the tester being destroyed should be a lesser concern that what would have happened if a 120 volt load was plugged in.

Oh I don't know, an incandescent lamp wouldn't be a costly as the tester.

JK, I know what you're saying.

Roger

 

[iwire]

We are investigating who did the wiring.

I am presently trying to contact the mfr of one of these testers to see what they have to say about how their tester would react to this unusual condition.

Or you could put that tester in a drawer and use a volt meter to check the wiring which is what I would do.

 

[dinos]

So who wired these assemblies? I think that is the problem that needs to be addressed. Many a tester has been destroyed being used on something that was improperly wired and unfortunately that will continue although testers are better at protecting themselves than they used to be.

To answer your original question, your tester will probably be damaged.

Roger

We are currently investigating who did the wiring.

 

[cowboyjwc]

A tester applied worng could do as much damage to you as to the tester. Look at the GFI testers with the cord. They say not to use them on an ungrounded system as there is a shock hazard.

So I would think that plugging in a 110V tester into a receptacle that was wired 220V even by accident, could be a bad thing.

 

[GoldDigger]

A tester applied worng could do as much damage to you as to the tester. Look at the GFI testers with the cord. They say not to use them on an ungrounded system as there is a shock hazard.

So I would think that plugging in a 110V tester into a receptacle that was wired 220V even by accident, could be a bad thing.

On a receptacle without an EGC connection, the load current for the LEDs and other circuitry could result in the nominal EGC and therefore the receptacle yoke, box and cover plate could be raised to 60V during the testing. But that is a condition that the tester is supposed to safely detect.
But if the line conductors are really ungrounded, it is possible that capacitive pumping, restriking ground faults, etc. could result in the circuit conductor voltage to ground exceeding the insulation limits of the tester (multiple times the nominal circuit voltage). That would be a lot more stressful on the tester and the person holding it than just doubling the line-to-line voltage while still not exceeding 125V to ground.

 

[dinos]

Or you could put that tester in a drawer and use a volt meter to check the wiring which is what I would do.

Agreed, but since these testers are specifically made to be plugged into standard 120V receptacles and perform something like 6 different diagnostic tests simultaneously, they are a great time saver over using a DVM when faced with many outlets to test.

Perhaps they could be designed to handle the possibility of line-to-line voltage being present.

 

[PetrosA]

I asked this question about my INSP-3 before I bought it. I traced down who made them (Tasco) and called them directly since the "support" people at Amprobe were just slightly more educated than those monkeys being tested at the typewriters. I talked to a guy named Steve who claimed that the INSP-3 is designed to be sold both here in N. America and in Europe and as such will handle 240V between various terminals.

 

[K8MHZ]

A tester applied worng could do as much damage to you as to the tester. Look at the GFI testers with the cord. They say not to use them on an ungrounded system as there is a shock hazard.

So I would think that plugging in a 110V tester into a receptacle that was wired 220V even by accident, could be a bad thing.

If the LEDs didn't just get brighter, they would go dark. I have applied over voltage to many LED's and incandescent bulbs over the years. They don't explode like transistors do. They just get bright, go poof, and the circuit opens.

I am not a fan of any GFCI tester that uses a button not on the GFCI itself. The shock hazard is there on the ice cube style testers, too, if you are working with metal covers. The other thing is, if you push the button you may trip a GFCI and not be able to find said GCFI.

 

[dinos]

I asked this question about my INSP-3 before I bought it. I traced down who made them (Tasco) and called them directly since the "support" people at Amprobe were just slightly more educated than those monkeys being tested at the typewriters. I talked to a guy named Steve who claimed that the INSP-3 is designed to be sold both here in N. America and in Europe and as such will handle 240V between various terminals.

This is interesting and is the kind of information I am hoping to get from one or more tester manufacturers.

I remember my wife teaching my son "words are important" and this comes into play often in trying to interpret specifications.

I'm looking at a Sperry tester spec, and it says "Operating Range: 120VAC" but I understand that "120VAC" is meant as the nominal voltage, and that a 120VAC circuit might have upwards of 132V steady state if I look at it from a "within the ITIC" perspective.

What is interesting about the Sperry instrument spec is that it also states "CAT III 300V". I will admit to not knowing the full meaning of the CAT class, but at a minimum I see it describes transient voltage conditions that the device can tolerate. So perhaps "CAT III 300V" means the device can handle transients which might occur on a circuit with a possible phase-neutral operating voltage of 300V, whereas the device is designed to handle steady-state voltages normally encountered on a nominal 120VAC circuit.

Perhaps the worst that can happen is that the 208V will cause the LED's to burn brighter for a time and then burn out?