jumper
Senior Member
- Location
- 3 Hr 2 Min from Winged Horses
Yeah I saw that, I ignored it since it just shoots more holes in my losing argument.
1/0 SER Al.
- Thread starter JDB3
- Start date
- Status
Yeah I saw that, I ignored it since it just shoots more holes in my losing argument.
- Location
- Chapel Hill, NC
- Occupation
- Retired Electrical Contractor
Ahhh you learned well my son. Ignore what shoots holes and you save face... :lol:Yeah I saw that, I ignored it since it just shoots more holes in my losing argument.
The entire 338.10(B) vs 310.15(2), (B)(6) has been so confusing since day 1 it is little doubt the CMP members disagree.
We are not on the '14 Code but I'm told it does little to clarify the situation.
It's a shame the CMPs can't develop a simple, easy to understand solution
We are not on the '14 Code but I'm told it does little to clarify the situation.
It's a shame the CMPs can't develop a simple, easy to understand solution
- Location
- Chapel Hill, NC
- Occupation
- Retired Electrical Contractor
If you read the wording in 2014 it clearly left out the wording that is in article 334 where it says that 310.(A)(2) shall not apply. IMO that means it should apply and therefore if the cable does not go thru insulation and only goes thru the firecaulk then we should be allowed to use 75C
JDB3
Senior Member
- Location
- San Antonio, Texas
Dennis Alwon said:
OK. If it is breaking down in "fire caulking" , wouldn't that be where it has NO breathing room at all? AND if it is "breaking down under full load", as Dennis said, we never have it under full load, or just for less than 60 seconds, perhaps, at the most when a/c or similar items start up. :jawdrop:
Last edited by a moderator:
MasterTheNEC
CEO and President of Electrical Code Academy, Inc.
- Location
- McKinney, Texas
- Occupation
- CEO
Actually I find 310.15(B)(7) easy to follow now. It finally made it clear that corrections and adjustments do apply. The issue of applying 310.15(A)(2) where applicable to SE cable is in my mind clear....since it does not exclude 310.15(A)(2) like it does in 334.80 then it can be applied. As for Dave, he is on that CMP but obviously he did not voice his facts during that process because as you can see another CMP member and IAEI representative on that panel gives a different view. Also all articles for submission are reviewed by multiple sources and did not object.
- Location
- Chapel Hill, NC
- Occupation
- Retired Electrical Contractor
Interesting. I wonder why he never responded to me when I questioned him on that. I guess he realized he was incorrect-- IDK
Wow! I wish I could learn to hush when I'm incorrect
So, the answer to the OP is ???
MasterTheNEC
CEO and President of Electrical Code Academy, Inc.
- Location
- McKinney, Texas
- Occupation
- CEO
Also remember...what Southwire tests only applies to their product. It the statement by Dave applies to all manufacturers then you would get a NEMA proposal and unified statement and none exists.
jumper
Senior Member
- Location
- 3 Hr 2 Min from Winged Horses
Move to Chicago and pipe everything in 4" RMC and use THHN/THWN-2 only. Problem solved.:happyyes:
Whadda ya think?
JDB3
Senior Member
- Location
- San Antonio, Texas
Just kind-of-hard to get 4" RMC inside the 2X4 studs (which has shrunk to perhaps 1 1/2" X 3 1/2"). A lot of homeowners would not appreciate the looks of 4" RMC, or having to shine it up when company came over! :happyyes:
- Location
- Chapel Hill, NC
- Occupation
- Retired Electrical Contractor
Wow! I wish I could learn to hush when I'm incorrect
So, the answer to the OP is ???
IMO the answer would depend on how much insulation the ser is passing thru. If it is more than 10' or where 310.15(A)(2) does not apply then 60C would be the temp. rating. If it is just caulking then 75C would rule.
That was my impression when the dust settled... just confirming
mjc763
Member
- Location
- Minneapolis Minnesota
This is what I was taught and at first I agreed with you but after reading this thread I have officially changed my mind to 310.15(A)(2) applies... Now the real question is what will the local ahj think since his onion is all that matters in the end.
- Location
- Chapel Hill, NC
- Occupation
- Retired Electrical Contractor
Most authority having jurisdiction's as well as ec will not even be aware of 310.15(A)(2) so you need to educate them
electricguy61
Senior Member
So if I understand this correctly, one could run SER attached to the underside of the roof framing where there is no insulation, (or have a means for the cable to be kept out of insulation, but maintain supports @ 4 1/2'), except where you run down the wall to the main or sub-panel, and be able to use the 75 degree rating?
jxofaltrds
Inspector Mike®
- Location
- Mike P. Columbus Ohio
- Occupation
- ESI, PI, RBO
Always read about the product that you are using.
"60?C - When terminated to equipment for circuits rated 100 amperes or less or marked for 14 through 1 AWG conductors."
http://www.southwire.com/ProductCatalog/XTEInterfaceServlet?contentKey=prodcatsheetOEM46
- Location
- Chapel Hill, NC
- Occupation
- Retired Electrical Contractor
MasterTheNEC
CEO and President of Electrical Code Academy, Inc.
- Location
- McKinney, Texas
- Occupation
- CEO
Whew......glad everyone came to their senses...lol
MasterTheNEC
CEO and President of Electrical Code Academy, Inc.
- Location
- McKinney, Texas
- Occupation
- CEO
Ok....from a manufacturers perspective always double check what you read. for example if the SouthWire ampacity table has 6-6-6 at the 90 degree rating as 60 A when it is 55 A. Again, remember that manufacturers post things we (they) want you to read....always do your own research.
For example....this one is correct and it's not SouthWire -http://www.encorewire.com/wp-content/uploads/EncoreWire_ALCAT_SER.pdf
- Status