277 volts on one phase

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fisherelectric

Senior Member
Location
Northern Va
Standing on a ladder reaching up through a grid ceiling with your *** and elbows on the grid working on a hot 277/480 v junction box is an excellent way to die. Or at least get hurt in a way you won't soon forget.
 

growler

Senior Member
Location
Atlanta,GA
I am trying to understand some of the concepts of 277/480 3 phase.


The concept of 480Y/277 3 phase is the same as 208Y/120 3 phase. The system is just operating at a higher voltage.

The only thing that people are trying to tell you is that as the voltage goes up so does the risk of working with it live.
 

sii

Senior Member
Location
Nebraska
Their "need" for a computer does not outweigh your need to be healthy. The sooner they and you figure that out the better for everyone involved.

I'm not sure how old you are but I'm guessing you're on the younger end of the spectrum. Twenty-six year old me would have laughed at that statement above, I guarantee you that forty-two year old me believes it whole-heartedly.
 

growler

Senior Member
Location
Atlanta,GA
Standing on a ladder reaching up through a grid ceiling with your *** and elbows on the grid working on a hot 277/480 v junction box is an excellent way to die. Or at least get hurt in a way you won't soon forget.


I saw a maintenance guy on an aluminum ladder through the grid leaning back on a sprinkler pipe. 277/480V live.

I tried to explain how dangerous this was but it didn't do any good.
 

degupita

Member
Location
Boulder Colorado
Standing on a ladder reaching up through a grid ceiling with your *** and elbows on the grid working on a hot 277/480 v junction box is an excellent way to die. Or at least get hurt in a way you won't soon forget.

You never had to work a job or contract where you didn't ever work on live circuits?

Because every company I worked for, big or small, I had and the other electricians I worked with did.

It goes like this. If the circuit is hot, and you want to undue the wires. Un-grounded hot phase first. Then grounded neutral.

If you want to connect the wires. Grounded neutral first, then ungrounded hot.
 

degupita

Member
Location
Boulder Colorado
Their "need" for a computer does not outweigh your need to be healthy. The sooner they and you figure that out the better for everyone involved.

I'm not sure how old you are but I'm guessing you're on the younger end of the spectrum. Twenty-six year old me would have laughed at that statement above, I guarantee you that forty-two year old me believes it whole-heartedly.

I am 48
Haven't been electrocuted yet.
At least not to where it hurt.
Just a few stuns.

But I wear gloves and safety glasses.

I have a very strong survival intuition.

If I feel uncomfortable or that something could happen, I will insist the power goes off or I cannot do it..

I have never had a foreman or company require that I work on circuits hot. They will ask if I am comfortable doing it.

If not, either they will do it or have the power shut off.

It sounds like several of you have never had that happen.
 

sii

Senior Member
Location
Nebraska
It also goes like this: what you are describing is unsafe. It can easily get you hurt or worse; granted, you may do this for years or the rest of your career without incident but why risk it? You and the people who employ you are putting your health, their business and the livelihood of everyone involved in jeopardy. Few on this board would deny ever having worked something hot, myself included. Noone on this board is going to agree with you and tell you it's the correct way to do things. I'll leave it to someone else to cite the OSHA & NFPA sections to justify my comments.
 

degupita

Member
Location
Boulder Colorado
The concept of 480Y/277 3 phase is the same as 208Y/120 3 phase. The system is just operating at a higher voltage.

The only thing that people are trying to tell you is that as the voltage goes up so does the risk of working with it live.

I know. But I am not, at this job, going to be. Because we tracked all the breakers for the circuits we are working on.
 

degupita

Member
Location
Boulder Colorado
It also goes like this: what you are describing is unsafe. It can easily get you hurt or worse; granted, you may do this for years or the rest of your career without incident but why risk it? You and the people who employ you are putting your health, their business and the livelihood of everyone involved in jeopardy. Few on this board would deny ever having worked something hot, myself included. Noone on this board is going to agree with you and tell you it's the correct way to do things. I'll leave it to someone else to cite the OSHA & NFPA sections to justify my comments.

I actually agree with you and that. It is safer and the correct way to work on circuits, is if they are denenergized.

If I never work on a live circuit again, I would be fine.

I am just saying, from what I have seen it is commonplace, not constantly, not regularly. But once in awhile.

And people can say it is that I just worked with bad companies. But it was every one of them, and some large respected companies.

The only one where we never worked on live circuits, was a DC UPS battery change out job.

Two separate people with lock out tag out locks. Everyone had to leave the room when the UPS was turned on. I was brought extra PPE to that, like I usually do.
 

sii

Senior Member
Location
Nebraska
I am 48
Haven't been electrocuted yet.
At least not to where it hurt.
Just a few stuns.

But I wear gloves and safety glasses.

I have a very strong survival intuition.

If I feel uncomfortable or that something could happen, I will insist the power goes off or I cannot do it..

I have never had a foreman or company require that I work on circuits hot. They will ask if I am comfortable doing it.

If not, either they will do it or have the power shut off.

It sounds like several of you have never had that happen.

Maybe I'm naive having never worked for a contractor.

Do this: imagine you get hurt or worse; regardless of how small the likelihood of that happening is. It doesn't matter how careful you are or who asked you if you were comfortable doing the work. What happens at your house with your family when you can no longer provide income for them or yourself. The person who asked you if you were comfortable is not going to take care of them.

Your gloves & glasses will only protect you from so much. Do you even know what arc flash is?

I've never before been angry while reading this forum. I'm going to curse if I post anything further tonight.
 

degupita

Member
Location
Boulder Colorado
Maybe I'm naive having never worked for a contractor.

Do this: imagine you get hurt or worse; regardless of how small the likelihood of that happening is. It doesn't matter how careful you are or who asked you if you were comfortable doing the work. What happens at your house with your family when you can no longer provide income for them or yourself. The person who asked you if you were comfortable is not going to take care of them.

Your gloves & glasses will only protect you from so much. Do you even know what arc flash is?

I've never before been angry while reading this forum. I'm going to curse if I post anything further tonight.

You shouldn't curse, because I don't disagree with you. {see last response, before yours}
You never worked for a contractor?
How did you become a licensed electrician?
What kind of electrical do you do, service calls?

It doesn't happen all the time, once in awhile, and since it happened at pretty much every place I worked, licensed journeymen, master electricians, electrical foremen, it seemed that people were aware of it.

But it sounds like it hasn't happened with people here. Or if so, they don't talk about it openly.

If so, I won't either.

But I have a few complaints about how apprentices are treated.

Mainly they are told to constantly work faster or they will be fired. They are so used to that, that even when they are told to go slow and be careful, some still try to push the limit.
 

mbrooke

Batteries Included
Location
United States
Occupation
Technician
Maybe I'm naive having never worked for a contractor.

Do this: imagine you get hurt or worse; regardless of how small the likelihood of that happening is. It doesn't matter how careful you are or who asked you if you were comfortable doing the work. What happens at your house with your family when you can no longer provide income for them or yourself. The person who asked you if you were comfortable is not going to take care of them.

Your gloves & glasses will only protect you from so much. Do you even know what arc flash is?

I've never before been angry while reading this forum. I'm going to curse if I post anything further tonight.

This is out of character for me, I always bite my tongue...

But my troll alarm is buzzing.
 

degupita

Member
Location
Boulder Colorado
Im curious, how many times have you been shocked?


IVe been hit wish DC so many times my arm goes numb sometimes :lol::eek:

I knew a guy that just did DC. He worked with me at the UPS DC battery change out. He had been at another one, and had taken the word of someone that said the circuit was not hooked. He went to attach something and got blown across the room, unconscious, hands badly burned. he didn't wear gloves even.

He still wouldn't wear them at the job we were at either. Not that gloves make you invincible.
 

mbrooke

Batteries Included
Location
United States
Occupation
Technician
Then get it replaced, because I am not a troll.

Read what I wrote. Every bit of it.

I have, and I apologize if you are being genuine.

However no offense but the questions you ask along with working live get me concerned. This need to be done correctly and no its never ok to work live.
 

user 100

Senior Member
Location
texas
I have an irregular heart beat. Didn't used to. Come to your own conclusions.

The cardiovascular impact of a bad hit is no joke-that stuff mbrooke posted earlier in the thread about delayed onset is true-
a bad shock can aggravate a preexisting arrythmia or trigger a new one. You may seem to be okay for some time only to croak due to sudden cardiac death years later. There can be other things affected as well, like your brain-many electricians aren't "right" after an event; some guys start to develop other symptoms like seizures and tics- all this because something just could ​not be de energized or someone wasn't careful enough.
 

jbelectric777

Senior Member
Location
NJ/PA
direct current at higher voltage levels is about as dangerous as it gets because it never hits zero allowing a person to break away, I wouldn't want anything to do with it, I saw some in nyc for some old high kv dc lines for an old elevator. this guy your all talking to about personal protective attire, is he in another country? india maybe? I don't mean any offense it just sounds that way from his english
 
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