Stainless Steel Pool

[infinity]

I have a stainless steel pool on the second floor of a building. Surrounding the pool is a crawlspace which is underneath the pool decking. Here's a few photo's of the pool wall before the decking was installed and then the finished product. Can branch circuit wiring be installed in the crawlspace within 5' of the pool wall?

 

[Fulthrotl]

I have a stainless steel pool on the second floor of a building. Surrounding the pool is a crawlspace which is underneath the pool decking. Here's a few photo's of the pool wall before the decking was installed and then the finished product. Can branch circuit wiring be installed in the crawlspace within 5' of the pool wall?

if the pool was buried in the ground, could you install conduit within 5' of the pool, in the ground?
i'd say yes. what say the AHJ?

back when, there was a stainless pool on a second floor of a hotel.....
there was stuff ran alongside it... and all the pool lighting had to be
in brass conduit.

 

[mwm1752]

Technically, bonding of metal within 5' should be done -- It is in a structure not earth -- no equipotential plane -- dry location wiring methods -- nothing I know of says you cannot run a non associated branch circuit beside the pool.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Here is the section which you obviously know however this would be an authority having jurisdiction call. IMO, I would say no can do

680.10 Underground Wiring Location. Underground
wiring shall not be permitted under the pool or within the
area extending 1.5 m (5 ft) horizontally from the inside
wall of the pool unless this wiring is necessary to supply
pool equipment permitted by this article. Where space limitations
prevent wiring from being routed a distance 1.5 m
(5 ft) or more from the pool, such wiring shall be permitted
where installed in complete raceway systems of rigid metal
conduit, intermediate metal conduit, or a nonmetallic raceway
system. All metal conduit shall be corrosion resistant
and suitable for the location. The minimum cover depth
shall be as given in Table 680.10.

 

[chris kennedy]

Here is the section which you obviously know however this would be an authority having jurisdiction call. IMO, I would say no can do

How is that underground wiring???

Ever see a pool in a high rise over the parking garage with all types of systems directly underneath it?

 

[Dennis Alwon]

How is that underground wiring???

Ever see a pool in a high rise over the parking garage with all types of systems directly underneath it?

You are correct my friend. I thought about that scenario but I was thinking the pool is sitting on dirt and the wiring was under it. I didn't read it carefully enough

 

[infinity]

Here is the section which you obviously know however this would be an authority having jurisdiction call. IMO, I would say no can do

That was the section mentioned in a recent discussion but it's specifically for underground. Seems kind of strange to require the underground wiring to be more than 5' but not the wiring in this installation. The wiring in question is for the LED pool lights and their associated drivers.

 

[brantmacga]

That was the section mentioned in a recent discussion but it's specifically for underground. Seems kind of strange to require the underground wiring to be more than 5' but not the wiring in this installation. The wiring in question is for the LED pool lights and their associated drivers.

Maybe this scenario hasn't come up to the CMP? Or maybe it has and that's why they specifically wrote "underground".

It seems the chances for shock would be more likely in an underground situation though. I've heard several instances firsthand of people being shocked in a pool, but I've never personally seen this happen.

A few years ago, I kneeled down on a damp sidewalk to glue PVC together that was trenched alongside the sidewalk. When my hands touched the dirt, I felt a very strong shock. The shoulder of the guy kneeling beside me was 2" from mine, and I watched a small arc pass between us.

There was an existing RMC install 3' away from us feeding site lighting, and there was a break in the wire inside. It wasn't enough to trip the breaker, but the RMC was energized and lit us up.

EDIT...... Looking at the pics again..... Are you talking about a crawl space beneath the structure, or that space between the shell and the steel beams it sits on top of?

 

[infinity]

EDIT...... Looking at the pics again..... Are you talking about a crawl space beneath the structure, or that space between the shell and the steel beams it sits on top of?

Yes, the crawl space adjacent to the pool walls. In the last photo the top decking has been added to create the crawl space.

 

[brantmacga]

That's interesting, but by definition still allowable I think. I wonder though, if that were back filled with dirt, would it be then considered underground? In that scenario I would maintain clearances. I'd like to know what MH would have to say on the matter.


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[Little Bill]

I say it's allowed because the wiring is for equipment associated with the pool. I don't see any difference in that and wiring run underground directly to pool lights.

 

[brantmacga]

Wiring for pool equipment is definitely allowed within 5'.... Which he did mention in a later post that was the concern. I'm curious though about non pool-related circuits being within 5' of the wall. 680 says it is permissible if there are space constraints and approved raceways are used. It looks like there is probably a little over 5' horizontally in that pic, so you could run your circuits to the outer edge of the deck. It's still an interesting scenario that could be expanded upon in the code, but the reality is that this pool isn't underground, and the wording of the code specifically says "underground".


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[infinity]

Wiring for pool equipment is definitely allowed within 5'.... Which he did mention in a later post that was the concern. I'm curious though about non pool-related circuits being within 5' of the wall. 680 says it is permissible if there are space constraints and approved raceways are used. It looks like there is probably a little over 5' horizontally in that pic, so you could run your circuits to the outer edge of the deck. It's still an interesting scenario that could be expanded upon in the code, but the reality is that this pool isn't underground, and the wording of the code specifically says "underground".

There was some mention of putting maintenance lighting in the crawl space so it would technically not be associated with the pool and might be closer than 5' but again the 5' dimension seems to only pertain when the pool is in the ground.

 

[mwm1752]

There are pools on the top deck of building with business or residential below them -- there would be no comprehensive way to wire for dwelling or business lighting if you could not install non associated wiring below or within 5' of the top deck pool. 680.10 only addressed in ground/earth type pool installation.