I have to connect 50 heat detectors, 7 smoke detectors, manual pull stations, strobes and some horns/strobes/bells to a conventional (non addressable) class A fire alarm panel. I am researching the NFPA 72 and found out the following. The heat ducts need a zone. Each room needs a zone. The manual pull stations need a zone as do the strobes/hornes/bells. I figure for a Monaco 2 conventional panel, I should get 4 zones per expansion card and will require a backplane card for my remote system annunciator. If I have 12 rooms, I calculate that I will require 15 zones, i.e. a zone each for 12 rooms, a zone for the heat ducts, a zone for the horns/strobes/bells, a zone for the pull stations. That makes 15 zones. The electrician estimated 30 zones without giving it a detailed look. I wonder if I am missing something since I am only comming up with 15 zones.
Fire Alarm Panel Zoning
- Thread starter eeee
- Start date
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ron
Senior Member
- Location
- New York, 40.7514,-73.9925
Re: Fire Alarm Panel Zoning
Why does each room need a zone?
If you need 15 or 30 zones, it is probably cheaper to install a small addressable FACP for all new devices and bring the new FACP into the existing non-addressable panel as one zone.
Why does each room need a zone?
If you need 15 or 30 zones, it is probably cheaper to install a small addressable FACP for all new devices and bring the new FACP into the existing non-addressable panel as one zone.
jtester
Senior Member
- Location
- Las Cruces N.M.
Re: Fire Alarm Panel Zoning
eeee
I'm not aware of any requirement for each room being a separate zone. You said you found that in NFPA 72, can you tell me where?
Jim T
eeee
I'm not aware of any requirement for each room being a separate zone. You said you found that in NFPA 72, can you tell me where?
Jim T
Re: Fire Alarm Panel Zoning
Typically, a whole floor can be one zone. Zones might be added for a Mechanical room, sprinkler flow on that floor, a 'special use' room, etc.
Duct detectors have their own zone, and they also perform shutdown of hvac equipment if they go into alarm.
Pull stations are needed at every pedestrian exit door (within 5'). Audio/visual devices may be needed in every room (schoolroom), or if the sound level would be objectionable, visual (strobe) only. Rest rooms often get strobes.
Zones should be designed to allow firefighters to know where to go to find the fire.
There are many others regs to fire alarm design. Some states require plan review by the State Fire Marshal before you can install one piece of cable. This can include expanding/replacing an existing fire alarm system.
Typically, a whole floor can be one zone. Zones might be added for a Mechanical room, sprinkler flow on that floor, a 'special use' room, etc.
Duct detectors have their own zone, and they also perform shutdown of hvac equipment if they go into alarm.
Pull stations are needed at every pedestrian exit door (within 5'). Audio/visual devices may be needed in every room (schoolroom), or if the sound level would be objectionable, visual (strobe) only. Rest rooms often get strobes.
Zones should be designed to allow firefighters to know where to go to find the fire.
There are many others regs to fire alarm design. Some states require plan review by the State Fire Marshal before you can install one piece of cable. This can include expanding/replacing an existing fire alarm system.
Re: Fire Alarm Panel Zoning
I have noticed that many of the existing fire alarm circuits emanating from the fire alarm panel have red boxes which I have been told are shut down circuits designed back in the 1950s, probably for the machinery and heat ducts. I expect that I will need to supply these boxes for this design also assuming they are not part of the Monaco 2 fire alarm panel (although I need to call Monaco again to validate).
I have noticed that many of the existing fire alarm circuits emanating from the fire alarm panel have red boxes which I have been told are shut down circuits designed back in the 1950s, probably for the machinery and heat ducts. I expect that I will need to supply these boxes for this design also assuming they are not part of the Monaco 2 fire alarm panel (although I need to call Monaco again to validate).
peter d
Senior Member
- Location
- New England
Re: Fire Alarm Panel Zoning
That is a ridiculous number of devices to connect to a conventional panel in this day and age.
I concur with the others. There is no requirement to have every room on a separate zone. With a conventional system, this would amount to a wiring nightmare. 15 zones on a class A system would mean 30 fire alarm cables or 30 pairs of conductors entering and leaving the contol panel. That's not counting the IDC loops and the HVAC shutdown loops and whatever else you may have. I can tell you it ain't gonna happen.
That is a ridiculous number of devices to connect to a conventional panel in this day and age.
I concur with the others. There is no requirement to have every room on a separate zone. With a conventional system, this would amount to a wiring nightmare. 15 zones on a class A system would mean 30 fire alarm cables or 30 pairs of conductors entering and leaving the contol panel. That's not counting the IDC loops and the HVAC shutdown loops and whatever else you may have. I can tell you it ain't gonna happen.
Re: Fire Alarm Panel Zoning
As you know, there are 64 zones capable in a Monaco M2 panel. Therefore, the panel is made to be wired for 64 zones and I have been told we have wired all 64 zones to one of our Monaco 2 Fire Control Panels already.
It should be noted for a conventional, class A system, 4 wires per conduit, two conduits per zone (although separated by 3 feet) makes 8 wires per zone for a conventional class A fire control panel.
My main concern is can I put more that one zone in a conduit and fill the conduit to capacity with fire cable? This way I can reuse some of my conduit for these expesive runs high in the rafters that require many tenured men and a lift truck.
As you know, there are 64 zones capable in a Monaco M2 panel. Therefore, the panel is made to be wired for 64 zones and I have been told we have wired all 64 zones to one of our Monaco 2 Fire Control Panels already.
It should be noted for a conventional, class A system, 4 wires per conduit, two conduits per zone (although separated by 3 feet) makes 8 wires per zone for a conventional class A fire control panel.
My main concern is can I put more that one zone in a conduit and fill the conduit to capacity with fire cable? This way I can reuse some of my conduit for these expesive runs high in the rafters that require many tenured men and a lift truck.
Re: Fire Alarm Panel Zoning
My comment related to the shutdown circuits is the following:
There are 10 8"X8" red boxes connected to a long rectangular junction box located above the fire control panel. Two conduits are connected between the fire control panel and this long rectangular junction box above, of which one of these is connected to the power subpanel after traversing throught the long rectangular junction box. The other conduit must be for signalling between IDCs and NADs. The existing fire control panel has two zones I see from the drawings. I see 13 conduits going up in to the rafters from the long rectangular junction box. I assume most of these are for the shutdown circuits emanating from the 8"X8" red boxes. Is this accurate to have all these individual red boxes for shutdown circuits, or are they now incorporated in to the fire control panel? I am going to call a Monaco rep now concerning this?
My comment related to the shutdown circuits is the following:
There are 10 8"X8" red boxes connected to a long rectangular junction box located above the fire control panel. Two conduits are connected between the fire control panel and this long rectangular junction box above, of which one of these is connected to the power subpanel after traversing throught the long rectangular junction box. The other conduit must be for signalling between IDCs and NADs. The existing fire control panel has two zones I see from the drawings. I see 13 conduits going up in to the rafters from the long rectangular junction box. I assume most of these are for the shutdown circuits emanating from the 8"X8" red boxes. Is this accurate to have all these individual red boxes for shutdown circuits, or are they now incorporated in to the fire control panel? I am going to call a Monaco rep now concerning this?
Re: Fire Alarm Panel Zoning
I just found out from the Monaco 2 rep that many zones can be placed in the same conduit, but you wouldn't want to do that if your devices are far from the conduit you wish to reuse.
Also shut down circuits are normally part of the fire control panel today and are not separate control boxes.
I just found out from the Monaco 2 rep that many zones can be placed in the same conduit, but you wouldn't want to do that if your devices are far from the conduit you wish to reuse.
Also shut down circuits are normally part of the fire control panel today and are not separate control boxes.
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