Electrical documentation responsability

[donaldsullivan]

A project has a one-line diagram showing the electrical components with conduit and wire sizes. The system is 277/480V, 3-phase, 4-wire. A letter is sent through the general contractor stating that a load has changed from 2hp to 15hp. The letter requests coordination of the motor starter to be changed to size 2 and the motor is changed to a 15hp. The electrical contractor made the change in the MCC. The conductors were never changed to #10cu THWN from #12cu THWN. As the engineer, I take some responsability for the wire not being upgraded. My question is what responsability does the electrical contractor have in terminating to equipment with undersized conductors.

Thanks for any comments.

 

[fc]

Re: Electrical documentation responsability

His responsibility is to tell the engineer and the GC that the wire size has to be changed and should not proceed with the job until he has a change order from them.

 

[volt101]

Re: Electrical documentation responsability

Money issues aside, the electrical contractor has a lot of the liability, the contractor has to do all electrical installations code compliant. Here in New Hampshire, if a case was made of it, his/her license would be in jeopardy. However, he bids to print, the inspector orders a change, he does have to fix it, but the contractor is not obligated to do it for free. :roll:

 

[charlie b]

Re: Electrical documentation responsability

A redesign of the horsepower rating provides a reasonable and fair opportunity for the EC to perform additional work for an additional fee. There is no reason I can think of for the EC not to include all necessary tasks in the submission of a ?Change Order Request,? or whatever contracting tool applies to the job. But I think the question comes down to this:
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• <font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Suppose the EC submitted a ?Change Order Request,? received approval, did the work, and submitted the invoice. Suppose it was later discovered that the wire had not been included. Is it now the responsibility of the EC to make the additional change-out of the wire at no additional charge to the owner?</font>

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">My initial inclination would be to say ?yes.? But before I did or said anything, I would look back at the paperwork. You alluded to a ?letter? that described the change in horsepower rating. I would want to see the way that letter had been worded, before I could take a stance on the question.

 

[benaround]

Re: Electrical documentation responsability

D.S.

I'm curious ,did the EC change the original circuit breaker? It would seem odd to spring for a 480vac breaker and not for every day #10. Also with 15hp drawing 21a at 480vac he may have thought it o.k.

frank

 

[donaldsullivan]

Re: Electrical documentation responsability

Thanks for the opinions.

Remember, I asked what the licensed electrician's responsability is.

benaround

EC changed complete Mcc bucker from a SZ1, 2HP; to a SZ2,15hp. 430.22(a) 21Alfc X 1.25%= 26.25A.
Table 310.13*, #12@25Amax, #10@30Amax, must use at least #10, and mayby larger if ambient temp. requires it or voltage drop is concern.

D.S.

 

[allenwayne]

Re: Electrical documentation responsability

Imo if the E.C changed the breaker then at that time he/she should have also included the wire change We don`t do alot od commercial work and I am nothing but a bonafide romex jockey but is we changed the spec trim from 5 kw elec heat to a 10 kw heat it would include the 60 amp breaker and the 6 se prewire.