Everyone is an electrician

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rodneee

Senior Member
There are plenty of electrical contractors not just complaining about the problem but doing something about it, in my area the EC,s stick together and police for guys working without permits in their area, they call the construction officials in day time hours and report it to an enforcement official who takes action and if they are working nights or weekends they call the police and file a complaint, all this can be done in some states with licensing laws.

shirley, you can not be serious...it seems odd, but if i read your post correctly you would have me believe that you and your fellow fellow EC's from your area have formed an informal vigillante permit enforcement group....how can you do this without a private detective license...why would you subject yourself to lawsuits and and potential jail time just to catch a non licensed person....
 

480sparky

Senior Member
Location
Iowegia
shirley, you can not be serious...it seems odd, but if i read your post correctly you would have me believe that you and your fellow fellow EC's from your area have formed an informal vigillante permit enforcement group....how can you do this without a private detective license...why would you subject yourself to lawsuits and and potential jail time just to catch a non licensed person....


Why does one need a PI license to report illegal activity? I doubt they're tapping phone lines, using lock-picking devices to enter personal property or rigging up hidden video cameras.

Jeez, all they're doing is calling the authorities when an illegal act is performed. You honestly think they can be thrown in the klink for that? Seriously? I guess I never should have called 911 when the guy crashed into my front yard last month.... I might be looking a hard time.
 

growler

Senior Member
Location
Atlanta,GA
you and your fellow fellow EC's from your area have formed an informal vigillante permit enforcement group....how can you do this without a private detective license...

You don't have to check to see if a permit is obtained. If there is construction going on such as a remodeling project there is a reqirement that a permit be "Posted".

Some areas you must post the permit out front and in others just put it up in a window but the permit is required to be in plain view.

There is no detective work needed, either a permit is posted or it isn't.
 

iwire

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Massachusetts
Yeah all this DIY type work is a new thing created by TV and the big box stores ......:grin::grin:


Here is an auction we missed, a 1919 house wiring book. You can also see a bunch from the 1950s.

http://cgi.ebay.com/VINTAGE-1919-POPPE-HOUSE-WIRING-BOOK-/250798755212


Here is a nice one from Montgomery Ward

http://www.onlineauction.com/index....e_Montgomery_Ward_Electric_Wiring_Book_1950’s


In the 1970s you could get panels, fuses, disconnects, conduit and wire right at Sears.


My point is that they have always been there, if they are breaking the law turn them in if you feel it's right, other than that why worry about it? :)
 

cadpoint

Senior Member
Location
Durham, NC
There's more to focus on... (period)

Can I be liberal and say it should be a concern as to what your doing verses worring about what other's are doing?

It's the not the nature of the work for you, it's the nature of the work your seeing, maybe that's the problem?
 

goldstar

Senior Member
Location
New Jersey
Occupation
Electrical Contractor
We're never going to stop the trunk-slammers. It's like the oldest profession - they've been here since the beginning of time:). If "Joe Sparks" wants to do an electrical job for his neighbor for $100 less than you so be it. What we need to police are those (without licenses) who advertise that they are doing electrical work. Here in NJ homeowners are permitted to do electrical work on their own houses but (technically) cannot do work on their neighbor's house. Any commercial or industrial work MUST be done by a licensed electrician. A commercial property owner CANNOT do work on his own building (although I'm sure it's done all the time). What most don't understand is that the liability in doing these jobs as unlicensed/un-insured contractors is greater than what the job is worth.
 

muskrat

Member
Location
St. Louis, MO
what they just said...plus the chance of personal injury to you or others. Saw the other day a re-wire of a pump at a propane filling pump...DONE IN EMT W/ SS FITTINGS RIGHT UP TO PUMP W/ A W/P SW. +/- 25 FT AT SOURCE. That should be reported to officials. Plus most AHJs don't have time to see all construction projects and its up to the populace to "help'. (in Gomer Pyle's voice..."citizens arrest, citizens arrest")
 

haskindm

Senior Member
Location
Maryland
This is nothing new and certainly not limited to the electrical trade. I just talked to a medical student that decided to change the motor oil in her car. Her attitude was "I am almost a Doctor, I cancertainly do anything that a 'grease monkey' can do". So she saved $29 and changed the oil herself. Only problem was, she put several quarts of motor oil in her automatic transmission! She now gets to pay the "grease monkey" to install a new transmission!
 

satcom

Senior Member
Homeowners are allowed to do their own work and that is how it should be, the issue is not about homeowners it is about the guys that feel rules and laws only apply to the other guy and go about contracting work, if you think they are just some poor guy trying to make his way, think again they have fully equipped work trucks and in most cases do not work for a few bucks less then the ligit contractors, they usually charge more and they are so bolden from getting away with operating they have branched out into the commercial work, the contractors that are paying their way and following all the rules are finally taking action to protect the industry.
 

cowboyjwc

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Simi Valley, CA
You don't have to check to see if a permit is obtained. If there is construction going on such as a remodeling project there is a reqirement that a permit be "Posted".

Some areas you must post the permit out front and in others just put it up in a window but the permit is required to be in plain view.

There is no detective work needed, either a permit is posted or it isn't.

Actually that's a local thing. Here you are only required to have the permit on site.
 

satcom

Senior Member
Actually that's a local thing. Here you are only required to have the permit on site.

In my state and most of the tri state area the card must be posted in plain view
We had a problem on one project where the card fell from plain view and in less then an hour we had the police arrive with the AHJ so yes every area may have different requirements on display but in these parts they are on display
 

Bronco25

Member
Add the "Maintenance Electrician" to the Scary List

Add the "Maintenance Electrician" to the Scary List

1. Electricity is a lot more forgiving in many cases than we give it credit for, otherwise there would be a lot more fires.

2. I see a lot of hack work installed by licensed electricians.

I do industrial work, and the hack jobs from the maintenance guy who learned from Pete, who worked with Bob, who got his training from Jim who read the code in 1857 go hand in hand with the contractor who goes in and does it that way so he can keep the business.
 

Electric-Light

Senior Member
This is nothing new and certainly not limited to the electrical trade. I just talked to a medical student that decided to change the motor oil in her car. Her attitude was "I am almost a Doctor, I cancertainly do anything that a 'grease monkey' can do". So she saved $29 and changed the oil herself. Only problem was, she put several quarts of motor oil in her automatic transmission! She now gets to pay the "grease monkey" to install a new transmission!

But the problem was contained within her car fortunately. Contractors get livid about Joe Schmoe doing "trade" work, but I don't see people get that livid about people changing tires on their own, despite we've had some fatalities with tires going through a restaurant window and such.
 

iwire

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Massachusetts
the issue is not about homeowners it is about the guys that feel rules and laws only apply to the other guy and go about contracting work

That may be the issue to you but go back and read the opening post and you can see that is not the issue to the person that started this thread.
 

satcom

Senior Member
That may be the issue to you but go back and read the opening post and you can see that is not the issue to the person that started this thread.

That was a response to another post in this thread not the ;op post in the op post he said everybody that covers a large group it would be better to define the type of electrician and the work he is doing, he does mention other trades and un licensed
 
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billsnuff

Senior Member
Add the "Maintenance Electrician" to the Scary List

As a Maintenance Electrician with years of experience I can tell you that I have dismissed several 'Industrial Electricians' who couldn't cut it. :mad::mad:

My crew is all liscensed and up to date on CEUs and training, even though its not required in my state. I know hack plumbers, carpenters, every trade has their share and their own issues. And there are some very smart people here that I can't hold a candle to, but I don't think that makes me any less an electrician.
I am aware of my limitations.

Actually when you paint with that broad of a brush, it's kinda hard not to get any on yourself.

Sorry, rant over. No offense intended.
 

satcom

Senior Member
Y1

Y1

[Q. Q UOTE=billsnuff;1302542]As a Maintenance Electrician with years of experience I can tell you that I have dismissed several 'Industrial Electricians' who couldn't cut it. :mad::mad:

My crew is all liscensed and up to date on CEUs and training, even though its not required in my state. I know hack plumbers, carpenters, every trade has their share and their own issues. And there are some very smart people here that I can't hold a candle to, but I don't think that makes me any less an electrician.
I am aware of my limitations.

Actually when you paint with that broad of a brush, it's kinda hard not to get any on yourself.

Sorry, rant over. No offense intended.[/QUOTE].

You paint a good picture of your view, all our guys were licensed and stayed current, many of them started as a helper and moved up, some were great electricians, and some struggled to move up but they all put in their best effort, everyone had some special area that they excelled in, as you said not all painted with the same brush
 

goldstar

Senior Member
Location
New Jersey
Occupation
Electrical Contractor
That may be the issue to you but go back and read the opening post and you can see that is not the issue to the person that started this thread.
You're right Bob. Sorry to drift off on a tangent. So, getting back on topic - to date whenever a plumber or HVAC guy has had to replace a boiler or A/C unit it's been acceptable for them to disconnect and reconnect AC power. Now, I've heard that both the plumbers and HVAC associations are lobbying the State of NJ and are asking to be allowed to install wiring pertaining to their specific units. I can't imagine what the repercussions of this will be.
 
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