Your home /afci install?

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celtic

Senior Member
Location
NJ
ItsHot said:
Just curious? If you were building your home, and your local code did not require afci's, would you still use them?
Does major renovations count?


:D


Let's see....
2002: Bought my shack
2003: NJ accepts 2002 NEC ~ AFCI language deleted
2003: Renov. work begins ~ I install no AFCI protection

2006: NJ accepts 2005 NEC ~ AFCI becomes "optional"
2006: Renov. work continues ~ I install no AFCI protection

2008: NJ has yet to accept the 2008 NEC...but rumor has it AFCI protection will be accepted:
6. NEC/2008, Article 210.12 ? Arc Fault Circuit Interrupters (AFCI):
The NEC/2008 expands the areas where AFCIs would be required. They would be required everywhere except kitchens, bathrooms, and garages. The old arguments -- that there are not many manufacturers, that AFCI are not generally available, and that they increase cost without a concomitant increase in safety -- are obsolete. AFCI are available and no longer add to the overall cost of the house, so this section of NEC/2008 is retained.
http://www.state.nj.us/dca/codes/ruleproposals/doc11.pdf

2008: I scramble to complete renov. before the 2008 NEC is accepted [usually between March and May of the following year ~ 2009 in this case]


Now when I go to sell this palace in 2010-ish....I may install AFCIs as a "incentive".
 

William1978

Senior Member
Location
N.C.
No I wouldn't install them in my house but, If I needed them to pass a final inspection I would and the first time they tripped because of a vaccum cleaner or something like that out they would come.
 

walkerj

Senior Member
Location
Baton Rouge
I have AFCI's on my bedrooms and smokes(house built in 2006).
I have computers, TV's, surround sound, fans, Fluorescents, incandescents, battery chargers, and the occasional vacuuming session. I have had zero problems with them.
The only problem is when the power goes out the one in my master bedroom trips upon the power coming back on:confused: .

If I built a new house I would go with whatever the code is on AFCI's because that's how I roll:D
 

electricmanscott

Senior Member
Location
Boston, MA
I would absolutley use them. As a matter of fact I have.

It fun to show people how they trip when I use my Lutron Spacer Syatem dimmers!!!

Oh wait, that's not possible, there is no such thing as nuisance tripping. :rolleyes: :grin:
 

electricalperson

Senior Member
Location
massachusetts
whats wrong with afci's? a properly wired circuit will cause no problems for them. i never had any of mine trip out of nowhere. only problem ive had was a few years ago we had a few homeline afci breakers that didnt trip when the test button was pushed. i would install afci's in my house.

hopefully someday they make AFCI/GFCI breakers to extend the code to the kitchens and bathrooms
 

celtic

Senior Member
Location
NJ
electricalperson said:
whats wrong with afci's? a properly wired circuit will cause no problems for them.

While that is true...why is it that the EC is now concerned with items plugged INTO the outlet:

William1978 said:
.... the first time they tripped because of a vaccum cleaner or something like that out they would come.

This is exactly what I have an issue with.

I also have issues with why every circuit in a home is not held to the high standard of 210.12(B) [with the notable exceptions of 210.8(A)]....the lighting in EVERY room is at risk ~ with the exception of the kitchen lights :-?


I have lots of issues :D ...these are but a few :wink:
 

electricalperson

Senior Member
Location
massachusetts
well if something is plugged in a receptacle and causes the afci to trip its not the breakers fault. the breaker is doing its job. get a new vaccuum.

i dont like it when people get mad when a breaker does its job. people always ask me to take GFCI's out because they keep tripping when they plug the christmas lights in outside
 

celtic

Senior Member
Location
NJ
electricalperson said:
well if something is plugged in a receptacle and causes the afci to trip its not the breakers fault. the breaker is doing its job. get a new vaccuum.
I agree with this comment.
Put the AFCI protection on the appliance/cordset...like they do for hair dryers:
hair-dryer-plug.jpg



As this is basically a dead issue....I'll just go back to using this very special blow dryer:
gun-blowdryer.jpg
 
electricalperson said:
well if something is plugged in a receptacle and causes the afci to trip its not the breakers fault. the breaker is doing its job. get a new vaccuum.

i dont like it when people get mad when a breaker does its job. people always ask me to take GFCI's out because they keep tripping when they plug the christmas lights in outside

I have found a large difference between GFCI's & AFCI's when it comes to nuisance tripping.

I would not remove a GFCI or GFI breaker.

I plead the 5th on removing AFCI's after inspection.
 

celtic

Senior Member
Location
NJ
iwire said:
What does that do for the branch circuit?

In the case of a blow dryer?
Nothing.

In the case of AFCI protection?
Puts the onus on the manufac. to protect their products.


Going back to the dryer....why is the GFCI even there?
Is it because not every home has had GFCI protection installed?
 

iwire

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Massachusetts
celtic said:
In the case of a blow dryer?
Nothing.

In the case of AFCI protection?
Puts the onus on the manufac. to protect their products.


Going back to the dryer....why is the GFCI even there?
Is it because not every home has had GFCI protection installed?

You lost me.

GFCI requirements are for outlets.

AFCI regiments are for circuits.

The appliance makers can do nothing to protect the branch circuits.
 

celtic

Senior Member
Location
NJ
IF the big issue with AFCI protection is protecting the wiring from various installers penetrating the insulation....why not require a AFCI test procedure of the ENTIRE home before occupation?

Now the HO moves into a problematic free home...and let the manufac.s put the silly ends on their products.
The EC sells a safe product...the manufac. sells a safe product.

When we start getting into homes built prior to 2002, AFCI protection is non-existent. It may very well be decades before the home is re-sold and - in some localities - require various death defeating devices like AFCI protection. But in the meantime...what? Let 'em burn?

**********
The above was being typed while iwire was hitting the reply button
**********

iwire said:
You lost me.
You're not used to that from me by now :smile:



iwire said:
GFCI requirements are for outlets.

AFCI regiments are for circuits.

The appliance makers can do nothing to protect the branch circuits.
I completely understand that.

But then WHY....is there GFCI cordsets on dryers?
Obviously, to ward off a Darwin Award for a person....and as we both agree, does nothing for the BC.

So then WHY...can't the same be done for other products used in a home (as detailed above)
 
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