Violation in photos

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mdshunk

Senior Member
Location
Right here.
Most of the 1970's 320 services featured a gutter. I never really puzzled on why that was. Maybe one hole lugs, permanently on the meter base load side? I typically see that gutter running long ways, up and down, between the two panels. That way, you can bring all the romexes in the tops of the panel like a normal person and not in the side like a Canadian.

That looks like a 1970's install in the OP's photos, with modern panel changeouts.
 

charlie k.

Senior Member
Location
Baltimore, Md.
250.92 I beleive is the article that covers bonding of service equipment. Also it does not look like they used double lock nuts on them there nipples. Kinda hard to tell from pics.

Charlie
 

TOOL_5150

Senior Member
Location
bay area, ca
Most of the 1970's 320 services featured a gutter. I never really puzzled on why that was. Maybe one hole lugs, permanently on the meter base load side? I typically see that gutter running long ways, up and down, between the two panels. That way, you can bring all the romexes in the tops of the panel like a normal person and not in the side like a Canadian.

That looks like a 1970's install in the OP's photos, with modern panel changeouts.

I did find that funny. :grin:

~Matt
 

steelersman

Senior Member
Location
Lake Ridge, VA
Either these are sub panels, and there are EGCs landed on the neutral bar, OR, these are service panels, and the bond screws are missing.
How can you be sure that there are bond screws missing? Did you zoom in on the photos? I wish he would have taken closer photos of these.

The panel on the right looks like the EGC's are on seperate ground bars than the neutrals making it look like it must be a sub-panel, but I highly doubt that these are sub-panels since this is in a house I'm pretty sure.
 

iwire

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Massachusetts
Also, I can't see any oxy on those AL terminations.

Can you point out a code section that requires it?

No bonding bushing, if this is the service.

I've never seen a bonding bushing required for a resi 120/240 service. Unless you're talking about plastic bushing to protect conductors #4 and above I don't think this is required.

If you using SE or SER no bonding bushing or plastic bushing is required.

That gutter more than likely contains service conductors, assuming they didn't install a disconnect outside in addition to the main breaker panels, so those raceways do require bonding of some sort. I just don't know the code reference off hand right now.

So it is because of the gutter/trough then? So it wouldn't need them if no trough?

Any metal raceway containing service conductors is required to be bonded by 250.92.

That said, the section only requires each raceway to be bonded once, the bonding might be done in the trough but I would not bet on it. :smile:
 

JohnJ0906

Senior Member
Location
Baltimore, MD
How can you be sure that there are bond screws missing? Did you zoom in on the photos? I wish he would have taken closer photos of these.
Yes, I zoomed in. I can't see the bond screws.
The panel on the right looks like the EGC's are on seperate ground bars than the neutrals making it look like it must be a sub-panel, but I highly doubt that these are sub-panels since this is in a house I'm pretty sure.

There is a ground bar in both panels. (A little hard to see in the left one, probably due to the angle)
 

ivsenroute

Senior Member
Location
Florida
They are mains as there is not disco on the exterior or interior other than the panels themselves. Here are some more photos of this professional installation:

IMG_1452.JPG



IMG_1465.JPG



IMG_1472.JPG
 

COFFEE TIME

Member
Location
PHILA PA
on the first set of pictures the right panel. besides some of some of the circuits double up on the 2pole cb's, is that a piece of #6 or 8 thhn wire going in the left side of that panel going to the breaker (3rd from the bottom on the right side)?
 

hardworkingstiff

Senior Member
Location
Wilmington, NC
Any metal raceway containing service conductors is required to be bonded by 250.92.

OK, so you have a metal raceway between the meter and the service disconnect with 3 conductors HHN. The meter base bonds the neutral to the enclosure and at the service disconnect, you bond the neutral to the enclosure. We now have parallel paths for neutral current between the meter enclosure and the service disconnect enclosure.

Why are we (NEC) not so concerned about this parallel path?
 
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