YOU make the call! Recep in kitchen bet

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YOU make the call! Recep in kitchen bet


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480sparky

Senior Member
Location
Iowegia
Beside being a lousy location for a receptacle where anyone walking by could snag a cord, I too believe this is an extension of the penisula which has already been properly provided with a receptacle.

But the location is similar to an island. Where on a typical island can you install a receptacle and not have the cord hanging over the edge?

Kitchen_Lighting.jpg
 

steelersman

Senior Member
Location
Lake Ridge, VA
But the location is similar to an island. Where on a typical island can you install a receptacle and not have the cord hanging over the edge?

Kitchen_Lighting.jpg
If you install a recept. face up in the countertop and just put a weatherproof cover on it then there is no need for a cord to hang over the edge unless you plug something into it that isn't stationed on the island, such as a vacuum cleaner. :)

Or you could put in a retractable cord with a recept. on the end hanging from the ceiling. :)
 

480sparky

Senior Member
Location
Iowegia
If you install a recept. face up in the countertop and just put a weatherproof cover on it then there is no need for a cord to hang over the edge unless you plug something into it that isn't stationed on the island, such as a vacuum cleaner. :).............
Um..........406.4(E).
th00008005.gif
 

Volta

Senior Member
Location
Columbus, Ohio
But the location is similar to an island. Where on a typical island can you install a receptacle and not have the cord hanging over the edge?

You don't think they would appreciate a nice pendant receptacle?:D

But really, after my impulsive vote for the outlet, then working hard to read the code that way, I know it's wrong to think the OP's could really be required where he showed it.

Whether we call it depth or width, as he showed, it is over 12" behind the sink.

Being wrong can be fun! :rolleyes:
 
I just voted no, but I think I may have hit the yes button...talk about confused. ;)


I am not sure if George had just an example or a real situation, but this is quite clear in the NEC as not requiring a receptacle. When dimensions such as this are provided, I am not so sure why it becomes so hard to figure out.

Also, I am surprised that no one referenced 210.52(C)(4).
 

George Stolz

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Windsor, CO NEC: 2017
Occupation
Service Manager
I just voted no, but I think I may have hit the yes button...talk about confused. ;)
Uh...yeah, you voted "yes". :D

Pierre said:
I am not sure if George had just an example or a real situation, but this is quite clear in the NEC as not requiring a receptacle.
It's a real scenario. I believe the prints showed the receptacle in the location it was installed. IIRC, the prints didn't clearly show such a large space next to the sink, I was under the impression that the sink was right on the edge of the peninsula. When trim time came along, it suddenly appeared that we were short a receptacle, which under the 2005 would be arguable - but the 2008 appeared to clarify exactly when 210.52(C)(4) kicks in.

I agree the use of the word "width" is a little confusing, but I believe it interchanges with "depth" in islands and peninsulas.

The exact same project is being built in Tennessee, and apparently they are being forced to add the second receptacle - I'd love to invite that inspector to the forum, but the GC is being mum about the fellow's phone number. ;)
 

jumper

Senior Member
Uh...yeah, you voted "yes". :D


It's a real scenario. I believe the prints showed the receptacle in the location it was installed. IIRC, the prints didn't clearly show such a large space next to the sink, I was under the impression that the sink was right on the edge of the peninsula. When trim time came along, it suddenly appeared that we were short a receptacle, which under the 2005 would be arguable - but the 2008 appeared to clarify exactly when 210.52(C)(4) kicks in.

I agree the use of the word "width" is a little confusing, but I believe it interchanges with "depth" in islands and peninsulas.

The exact same project is being built in Tennessee, and apparently they are being forced to add the second receptacle - I'd love to invite that inspector to the forum, but the GC is being mum about the fellow's phone number. ;)

I never saw the part about using the 2008, I read the question at 5:30am. If this question was in the 05, which I mistakenly used, would the receptacle be required? I do not have 08 code book. What change did they make or clairify?
 

George Stolz

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Windsor, CO NEC: 2017
Occupation
Service Manager
I never saw the part about using the 2008, I read the question at 5:30am. If this question was in the 05, which I mistakenly used, would the receptacle be required? I do not have 08 code book. What change did they make or clairify?
They changed the text to clarify when to apply 210.52(C)(4):

210.52(C) Countertops. In kitchens, pantries, breakfast rooms,
dining rooms, and similar areas of dwelling units, receptacle
outlets for countertop spaces shall be installed in accordance
with 210.52(C)(1) through (C)(5).
Where a range, counter-mounted cooking unit, or sink
is installed in an island or peninsular countertop and the
width of the countertop behind the range, counter-mounted
cooking unit, or sink is less than 300 mm (12 in.), the
range, counter-mounted cooking unit, or sink is considered
to divide the countertop space into two separate countertop
spaces as defined in 210.52(C)(4).
Each separate countertop
space shall comply with the applicable requirements in
210.52(C).
Prior to 2008, we have to rely on 90.4 to know when a sink separates a counter space.
 
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