200.6(A) vs 200.7(C)

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Not only do I keep seeing this in the field but I occasionally get into an argument over this. It seems pretty cut and dry in the NEC. Please clarify if I'm wrong.

In laymans terms, you can make white conductor hot (of any gauge), but you can't make a black conductor a neutral unless it's #6 or larger. Correct?

I have argued with people who insisted you can't phase tape a once grounded conductor to indicate that it is now an ungrounded conductor(of any size), but IMO, that's a good way to kill someone, or at the very least, zap the hell out of them.

Same reason why I get snippy with people for using a SP T-stat on 240v baseboard heaters.....

My interpretation of 200.6 and 200.7 is correct, yes?

Thanks guys.
 

Dennis Alwon

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Well you can only tape a white conductor and make it hot if it is part of a cable assembly such as NM cable and other cases noted in 200.7(C) (1-3).
 
Correct. So, I suppose that would exclude THHN in conduit then.

I know the reason is supposed to be that wire gauges smaller than #6 are readily available in multiple colors so you should be using the correct color for the application, but in old work situations where someone didn't do this, I always phase tape regardless for the next guy.

I wonder if that would put me in violation.... ;)
 
Only one hot leg being disconnected.

I suppose the problem lies with the electrician assuming that the T-stat can be used as a disconnect for servicing only to find out he was sorely mistaken later on.
 

480sparky

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Only one hot leg being disconnected.

I suppose the problem lies with the electrician assuming that the T-stat can be used as a disconnect for servicing only to find out he was sorely mistaken later on.

Stats are only controllers, not disconnects. If someone assumes turning a stat down will disconnect the power, then they need to go back to skool and lern sum moor.:grin:
 

Dennis Alwon

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Stats are only controllers, not disconnects. If someone assumes turning a stat down will disconnect the power, then they need to go back to skool and lern sum moor.:grin:

This is true but I always install a DP T-Stat for extra safety. They don't cost that much more so why not.
 
Eh.... Your logic is somewhat flawed but yes, your right.

Why leave anything to chance tho? If you need to kill power to something then why not actually kill power to it (all power)?

That's just one of those things that irk me I suppose.
 

480sparky

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Eh.... Your logic is somewhat flawed but yes, your right.

Why leave anything to chance tho? If you need to kill power to something then why not actually kill power to it (all power)?

That's just one of those things that irk me I suppose.

Flawed? Does the stat have an "Off" marked on it? Can it be locked in that position? If not, then it's not a disconnect.
 
Just because I said I get into frequent arguments about it doesn't mean that I actually like to argue about it. ;)

To me, it's just common sense and protecting the next guy. Yes, they are not classified as a disconnecting means but when you have a 240v baseboard heater run in a 3rd floor attic, I certainly don't want to walk down 3 flights of stairs to kill the breaker and then another 3 just to get back.
 
Just because I said I get into frequent arguments about it doesn't mean that I actually like to argue about it. ;)

To me, it's just common sense and protecting the next guy. Yes, they are not classified as a disconnecting means but when you have a 240v baseboard heater run in a 3rd floor attic, I certainly don't want to walk down 3 flights of stairs to kill the breaker and then another 3 just to get back.

a few climbing stairs for SAFETY. I wonder where Zog is, Im sure he would have something to say about this. ;)
 

iwire

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Eh.... Your logic is somewhat flawed but yes, your right.

Why leave anything to chance tho? If you need to kill power to something then why not actually kill power to it (all power)?

That's just one of those things that irk me I suppose.

It can irk you all day long but it is NEC compliant.:smile: Take a look at 424.20(B) and 424.21.

You should know if any type of switch is not indicating (ON/OFF, I/O, Open/Closed, etc) NEVER count on it to open all conductors or meet other requirements of a disconnecting means.

Like Dennis, I typically used two pole stats but never assume the other guy did. :smile:
 

cpal

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Location
MA
In laymans terms, you can make white conductor hot (of any gauge), but you can't make a black conductor a neutral unless it's #6 or larger. Correct?.


not to be a nit, but that would be # 4 or larger, actally I guess it could be #5 or larger. The heading reads

200.6 (B) Sizes Larger Than 6 AWG.

:)
 
a few climbing stairs for SAFETY. I wonder where Zog is, Im sure he would have something to say about this. ;)

Hey! I'm not as fit as I used to be. ;)

I just did a service call with some 240's in a finished attic. SP stat, no phase tape on the white conductors. 2 flights of stairs from the front door to the attic. 3 flights down to the basement, 3 flights back up. Diagnose/fix, 3 flights back down to the basement, 3 flights back up to the attic to test, 2 flights back down to the front door to get my check and leave.

Let's count em, shall we? 16 flights of stairs because someone wanted to save a few dollars on a T-stat. Conductors screaming 120v (and tstat) because someone didn't want to spend 4-5 minutes taping the white conductor at each accessible point....

And I thought I was lazy for not wanting to walk all those stairs! :grin:

And yes Larry, I was going to mention that. Throw in a DP stat that always says "off" and your covered.
 
not to be a nit, but that would be # 4 or larger, actally I guess it could be #5 or larger. The heading reads

200.6 (B) Sizes Larger Than 6 AWG.

:)

Thanks for the correction. I didn't actually catch that one! Saw #6 and it stuck in my head.
 
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