Air Sealing outlets

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goldstar

Senior Member
Location
New Jersey
Occupation
Electrical Contractor
Is there any requirement (Energy, International, NEC Code, etc.) that requires us to air-seal switch and receptacle junction boxes when installed on an outside wall ? This came up in a discussion at one of my contractors' meetings and someone mentioned that one EI is requiring it but didn't site a Code reference. I'm wondering if he just found some obscure Code section that he is not sharing with other EI's or EC's or if there really is a requirement. Also, if there is such a requirement, is there a product out on the market that is ready-made and can be installed without any other means of air-sealing ? Thanks
 

mopowr steve

Senior Member
Location
NW Ohio
Occupation
Electrical contractor
It may be found in the ASHRAE code or other local energy codes.

And yes there are boxes made for your particular situation, I think Arlington makes a plastic box that has a flange around it with a foam gasket that seals up to the back side of drywall.
 

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
There probably is energy codes in many places that would require this. A little surprising though that the EI is the one enforcing it. I can see them being aware of the rule and recommending you fix it or someone else will make you fix it.

I would think the construction of said wall would impact what means may be necessary at a particular outlet or junction box as well. If they flash foamed the exterior side of the wall cavity and sealed any entries (like the wiring method to your outlet box) then there isn't much of anything any additional seal at the box will accomplish.
 

infinity

Moderator
Staff member
Location
New Jersey
Occupation
Journeyman Electrician
Thanks, I found these : http://www.aimedia.co/media/spec-sheets/VAPOR_BOXES.pdf . They're a great idea. Now we just have to figure out if they are a Code requirement or not.


I could see using an item like that in lieu of another method but I would guess that they're not required for the EC to install them. Maybe Rick Napier will chime in on how the DCA is handling this. IMO it should be part of the building envelope inspection and these shouldn't be required unless no other method is available to comply with the energy code.
 

goldstar

Senior Member
Location
New Jersey
Occupation
Electrical Contractor
I could see using an item like that in lieu of another method but I would guess that they're not required for the EC to install them. Maybe Rick Napier will chime in on how the DCA is handling this. IMO it should be part of the building envelope inspection and these shouldn't be required unless no other method is available to comply with the energy code.
I like these boxes and I think they're a good idea. The problem I'm having with them is with respect to kitchens. Back-splashes are usually located on outside walls and I like to use adjustable boxes, knowing that somewhere down the line the HO is going to have a tile guy install tiles or granite on that back-splash. Many of the tilers that I've had experiences with cannot grasp the idea of tiling up to the outside of the box and not infringing into the open space of the box. I've often had to deal with re-installing switches and receptacles because the tile guy wasn't able to use the 3/4" screws that come with the devices and then ends up using 2" sheet-rock screws instead. I've even had some where the 3/4" screw just barely gripped into the threads of the JB and then loosened up a short time later and the whole device wobbles in place. If they made them for adjustables I'd use them every time.
 

goldstar

Senior Member
Location
New Jersey
Occupation
Electrical Contractor
If they flash foamed the exterior side of the wall cavity and sealed any entries (like the wiring method to your outlet box) then there isn't much of anything any additional seal at the box will accomplish.
I haven't worked for any GC's that flash foam like they do on "Holmes on Homes". Most of them use Tyvec plastic wrap on the outside sheathing and then foam and siding or insulated siding. Inside they use std. Pink Panther type insulation with a vapor barrier.

I think there was some talk (possibly in another thread) about the effects of that flash foam insulation on NM cable but I don't recall if there was ever a study or an opinion issued by any authority.
 
Greetings,

The inspector is probably trying enforce the International Energy Conservation Code(IECC). You need to find out if NJ is is using this code.

I found this product (http://www.lessco-airtight.com/) that will allow you to still use the adjustable boxes. There is another product like this one except it is basically a plastic barrier that you place behind the box...I can't find the URL I had for this one, but once I do I will post it.:(


I like these boxes and I think they're a good idea. The problem I'm having with them is with respect to kitchens. Back-splashes are usually located on outside walls and I like to use adjustable boxes, knowing that somewhere down the line the HO is going to have a tile guy install tiles or granite on that back-splash. Many of the tilers that I've had experiences with cannot grasp the idea of tiling up to the outside of the box and not infringing into the open space of the box. I've often had to deal with re-installing switches and receptacles because the tile guy wasn't able to use the 3/4" screws that come with the devices and then ends up using 2" sheet-rock screws instead. I've even had some where the 3/4" screw just barely gripped into the threads of the JB and then loosened up a short time later and the whole device wobbles in place. If they made them for adjustables I'd use them every time.
 

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
I haven't worked for any GC's that flash foam like they do on "Holmes on Homes". Most of them use Tyvec plastic wrap on the outside sheathing and then foam and siding or insulated siding. Inside they use std. Pink Panther type insulation with a vapor barrier.

I think there was some talk (possibly in another thread) about the effects of that flash foam insulation on NM cable but I don't recall if there was ever a study or an opinion issued by any authority.

IMO especially on walls infiltration is a much bigger issue then R value of the wall. Until spray foam contractors popped up in this area what you described was fairly typical. Now most larger projects have a thin foam layer on the inside covering all of the exterior. It has virtually no infiltration if done correctly. IMO you could just drywall as is and it would still be pretty energy efficient wall, but they usually put in either batts or loose fill insulation to fill the remainder of the wall cavities. No need for plastic vapor barrier the foam serves that purpose.
 

JohnE

Senior Member
Location
Milford, MA
I still have trouble grasping that the EI's in NJ enforce building code. But I'll catch on. The air sealing is a requirement in the IECC as already mentioned, if your area has adopted it.
 

dkidd

Senior Member
Location
here
Occupation
PE
Is there any requirement (Energy, International, NEC Code, etc.) that requires us to air-seal switch and receptacle junction boxes when installed on an outside wall ? This came up in a discussion at one of my contractors' meetings and someone mentioned that one EI is requiring it but didn't site a Code reference. I'm wondering if he just found some obscure Code section that he is not sharing with other EI's or EC's or if there really is a requirement. Also, if there is such a requirement, is there a product out on the market that is ready-made and can be installed without any other means of air-sealing ? Thanks

See http://forums.mikeholt.com/showthread.php?t=180664.

This forum is a great resource. ;)

And it is "cite".
 

sullivant

Member
Location
Holyoke, MA USA
Greetings,

The inspector is probably trying enforce the International Energy Conservation Code(IECC). You need to find out if NJ is is using this code.

I found this product (http://www.lessco-airtight.com/) that will allow you to still use the adjustable boxes. There is another product like this one except it is basically a plastic barrier that you place behind the box...I can't find the URL I had for this one, but once I do I will post it.:(

Under the Stretch Energy Code, these gasketed style boxes meet the requirment. BUT, not all locations have accepted the new Stretch Energy Code.... Ask the Building Department where you are working........
 

GoldDigger

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Placerville, CA, USA
Occupation
Retired PV System Designer
You are correct. Freudian slip or old age setting in.:cool:

Thanks for the link to the other thread.
When you cite the code you are indicating what site in the code you are referring to. :angel:
That way someone else can sight the relevant code more easily.

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk
 
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