Sand Gas Line to bare metal

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wrobotronic

Senior Member
Location
Colorado
Is there a specific code reference that says when bonding black iron it has to be sanded to bare metal? or is this up to the AHJ?

Thank all,
Cheers,
WROBO
 

infinity

Moderator
Staff member
Location
New Jersey
Occupation
Journeyman Electrician
I was always under the impression that the clamp is designed to go on the pipe without modification of the pipe. Now if the pipe after installation is painted you might need to remove the paint.
 

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
AFAIK the "teeth" in those bonding clamps are partly there to bite through paint, rust, etc.

You sand off any coatings on the pipe and you invite corrosion to the parts not engaged by the "teeth".
 

infinity

Moderator
Staff member
Location
New Jersey
Occupation
Journeyman Electrician
CSST bonds are connected to the small section of black pipe adjacent to the meter everyday around here.
 

augie47

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Tennessee
Occupation
State Electrical Inspector (Retired)
How often to you have to educate inspectors that the gas line is bonded by the EGC serving the appliance? In my experience, there are only like 6 inspectors in the country that know that one :roll:
Post #7 (after yours) is part of the key. We finally get the point across that the EGC can serve as the bond then the CSST rules come into play and we have to use that word "except".
My experience when there are variables, such as here or one vs two rods, etc., some contractors just tell there men to take the cautious road rather than have to go back.
 

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
Post #7 (after yours) is part of the key. We finally get the point across that the EGC can serve as the bond then the CSST rules come into play and we have to use that word "except".
My experience when there are variables, such as here or one vs two rods, etc., some contractors just tell there men to take the cautious road rather than have to go back.
IMO inspecting bonding of CSST isn't the job of an EI, should be whoever inspects the gas piping, special bonding rules of such piping only apply to one series of product and not to gas piping in general.

Haven't been asked to bond any for some time now but considering telling anyone that does ask to pound sand, if anything install an intersystem bonding terminal if one isn't present and tell them it is there for others to use to connect to the electrical grounding system. Special bonding of such piping is one task of installing the piping and I am not a gas line installer.
 
Post #7 (after yours) is part of the key. We finally get the point across that the EGC can serve as the bond then the CSST rules come into play and we have to use that word "except".
My experience when there are variables, such as here or one vs two rods, etc., some contractors just tell there men to take the cautious road rather than have to go back.

Yes I agree that CSST may require bonding per the manufacturer, but I also agree with Kwired that in that case, its not my job. .
 

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
So you wouldn't do it even if you get paid to do it?
What is my liability and is it worth it? I am not a gas pipe fitter, my insurance assumes I don't do gas pipe fitting. Installing this bonding conductor(s) is a task of installing certain types of gas piping and is not "electrical installations".

I have done electrical work at bulk fuel plants and seen bonding jumpers installed between fuel piping, tanks, and other equipment by the fuel guys. why is this CSST any different. They need to put in whatever is necessary to protect their equipment, I only need to install a GES for the electrical system and EGC's with my branch circuits and feeders, I am required to bond to metal piping systems, but gas piping is allowed to be bonded by "my code" by the EGC of the circuit(s) most likely to energize the piping - most cases the EGC to a furnace supplied by the piping.
 

Smart $

Esteemed Member
Location
Ohio
ECM doesn't tell me what my job is:happyyes:

Said this before even looking at the link BTW.

Nazi soldiers got paid to commit genocide. Sometimes its about principles and what's right not money
You two seem quite adamant about not doing it. I do not believe you have a legitimate reason. Either way, no skin off my baseballs. It's just that you two make it sound as though no electrician should touch CSST bonding. Doing it or not is a matter of choice... and the right to make that choice.
 

hbiss

EC, Westchester, New York NEC: 2014
Location
Hawthorne, New York NEC: 2014
Occupation
EC
... install an intersystem bonding terminal if one isn't present and tell them it is there for others to use to connect to the electrical grounding system. Special bonding of such piping is one task of installing the piping and I am not a gas line installer.

I'm surprised someone doesn't suggest that it is the ECs responsibility to provide the ground bond for telephone, cable and satellite too.

-Hal
 

don_resqcapt19

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Illinois
Occupation
retired electrician
Post #7 (after yours) is part of the key. We finally get the point across that the EGC can serve as the bond then the CSST rules come into play and we have to use that word "except".
My experience when there are variables, such as here or one vs two rods, etc., some contractors just tell there men to take the cautious road rather than have to go back.
There is nothing in the NEC that requires bonding for the CSST other than the EGC that serves the equipment connected to the CSST. You have to go to other codes or manufacturer's instructions to get the CSST bonding. There were a number of attempts to get that bonding in the NEC but were rejected by CMP5 because there is no credible technical substantiation to support those bonding requirements. The CSST people took an end run and got rules in NFPA 54 to require that bonding, but not sure how many places actually adopt 54 as an enforceable document.
 
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