Service grounding

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rojay

Senior Member
Location
Chicago,IL USA
Is it proper to connect a GEC for a service at more than one location?
I see this all the time on residential services- two supplemental ground rods bonded together and tied to the meter can outside of the house and then a run from the panelboard inside to the water main. Shouldn’t the electrodes be bonded together and then tied to either the service disconnect at the panelboard inside or outside at the meter can? I thought tying GEC’s at two separate locations was a code violation?
 

jumper

Senior Member
Lemme see if I got this right.

GEC to two rods tied in at meter. Meter bonded to neutral.

Another GEC to water line tied in at main panel. Assume Neutral and Ground are bonded together in panel, with 3 wire from meter to panel. Panel bonded to neutral.

If so, unconventional but prolly okay.
 

infinity

Moderator
Staff member
Location
New Jersey
Occupation
Journeyman Electrician
It's very common and permitted.

250-53d2-02.gif
 

david

Senior Member
Location
Pennsylvania
Is it proper to connect a GEC for a service at more than one location?
I see this all the time on residential services- two supplemental ground rods bonded together and tied to the meter can outside of the house and then a run from the panelboard inside to the water main. Shouldn’t the electrodes be bonded together and then tied to either the service disconnect at the panelboard inside or outside at the meter can? I thought tying GEC’s at two separate locations was a code violation?

i would think if given the option you would take the more direct path outside the building to earth

i think the meter enclosure is a good optiion
 

infinity

Moderator
Staff member
Location
New Jersey
Occupation
Journeyman Electrician
I should have said uncommon IME instead of unconventional maybe. Few POCOs I have worked with allow me to use the meter base.

Must be a regional thing, around here the connection is not permitted in the meter enclosure by the POCO but I have seen this commonly elsewhere in the country.
 

rojay

Senior Member
Location
Chicago,IL USA
Funny that you mention 250.24.
250.24A1 is the section that I heard cited to claim that the grounding scenario in my OP was a violation:D
The fact that the GEC connection is to be made at any accessible point from the load end of the service lateral to (and including)the neutral bus at the service disconnect was being used as an “either, or but not both” statement.
 

petersonra

Senior Member
Location
Northern illinois
Occupation
engineer
Is it proper to connect a GEC for a service at more than one location?
I see this all the time on residential services- two supplemental ground rods bonded together and tied to the meter can outside of the house and then a run from the panelboard inside to the water main. Shouldn’t the electrodes be bonded together and then tied to either the service disconnect at the panelboard inside or outside at the meter can? I thought tying GEC’s at two separate locations was a code violation?

There is only one GEC. The other wires are bonding conductors.
 

trojans4

Member
Location
Iowa
gas pipe

gas pipe

Adding to this thread, if in the original OP's situation with two ground rods and an GEC to a metal water pipe system can a metal gas piping system in the same house be bonded to a water pipe with #6 copper or does the #6 copper have to go all the way back to the main panel and be bonded there? In any case is this #6 copper a GEC or an EGC?
 

jumper

Senior Member
Adding to this thread, if in the original OP's situation with two ground rods and an GEC to a metal water pipe system can a metal gas piping system in the same house be bonded to a water pipe with #6 copper or does the #6 copper have to go all the way back to the main panel and be bonded there? In any case is this #6 copper a GEC or an EGC?

A gas pipe is never an electrode. So, no GEC.

Gas lines may be bonded through an EGC or a bonding jumper. See 250.104(B)

Article on gas lines and bonding.https://www.ecmag.com/section/codes-standards/grounding-and-bonding-gas-piping
 

infinity

Moderator
Staff member
Location
New Jersey
Occupation
Journeyman Electrician
Adding to this thread, if in the original OP's situation with two ground rods and an GEC to a metal water pipe system can a metal gas piping system in the same house be bonded to a water pipe with #6 copper or does the #6 copper have to go all the way back to the main panel and be bonded there? In any case is this #6 copper a GEC or an EGC?

Sounds like a bonding jumper. If this is CSST some places require that it be bonded otherwise as Jumper stated no additional gas pipe bond is required if it's black gas pipe.
 

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
I should have said uncommon IME instead of unconventional maybe. Few POCOs I have worked with allow me to use the meter base.

Must be a regional thing, around here the connection is not permitted in the meter enclosure by the POCO but I have seen this commonly elsewhere in the country.

We have a POCO around here that wants a ground rod connected to the meter enclosure regardless of whatever electrodes you may have connected elsewhere.
 
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