Mixed feelings

Status
Not open for further replies.
Location
NE (9.06 miles @5.9 Degrees from Winged Horses)
Occupation
EC - retired
We use the 6 foot exemption for AFCIs whenever we can but are less concerned about nuisance trips then we were just a few years ago. The guys have become fairly adept at tracking down problems.

The item below is the remnants of a Nutone H/V/L. We had changed out the Pushmatic panel during a remodel to a CH. This was on a 15 amp CB because 14 AWGs get a 15 at change out. We used the exemption.

We don’t know how many times the breaker was reset or how long it ran before the first trip. The house has been unoccupied for a few months so it could have run for quite some time. Damage was contained within the housing AFAIK, but dang, so close. FWIW, we added smokes during the remodel.
E05AD74C-50C4-49A5-B21A-FE77F70AD5FA.jpg
 

romex jockey

Senior Member
Location
Vermont
Occupation
electrician
An afci will not mitigate a glowing connection , the 2nd thing to ask is how many times have Nutone products been fire sarters? Anecdotally, i've seen my share of H/F/L (emphasis on H) go china

~RJ~
 

Coppersmith

Senior Member
Location
Tampa, FL, USA
Occupation
Electrical Contractor
We use the 6 foot exemption for AFCIs whenever we can but are less concerned about nuisance trips then we were just a few years ago. The guys have become fairly adept at tracking down problems.

I don't have mixed feelings at all. I've come to accept the fact that if I insist on using AFCI breakers it raises the price above where I can sell the job i.e. no job. I have tried using the safety argument with customers many times. 99% of customers don't care. They think I'm trying to fool them into spending more money. All they care about is my price verses my competators.

Adding AFCI's also becomes a nightmare when the nuisance trips you mention happen. I'll give a customer a fixed price to do the job and then all the profit is sucked out of it tracking down years of wiring errors. The only place I install AFCI's is in new construction I did myself or if I'm forced to by exceeding the 6 foot rule.
 
Last edited:

peter d

Senior Member
Location
New England
I can't tell you how many call backs I had from them when working for an EC that did mostly new construction, almost all due to some incompatibility with appliances. I have no mixed feelings about them at all either.

Now, in the case of your example, you say the breaker was "reset"? I'm assuming a wire shorted to the metal housing, causing the breaker to trip using the ordinary magnetic function of the breaker. No AFCI needed. What added protection would an AFCI add? :?
 

jap

Senior Member
Occupation
Electrician
It seems the HVL's burning up has become more and more common lately regardless of whether or not they are on an AFCI circuit.

Not sure what's going on.

JAP>
 

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
Question is was there an electrical failure or did something foreign get ignited by the heater? Those collect a lot of lint over time.

Motors on such units are usually impedance protected. That don't mean they won't get hot. Hot enough to ignite accumulated lint.
 

tortuga

Code Historian
Location
Oregon
Occupation
Electrical Design
We use the 6 foot exemption for AFCIs whenever we can but are less concerned about nuisance trips then we were just a few years ago. The guys have become fairly adept at tracking down problems.

The item below is the remnants of a Nutone H/V/L. We had changed out the Pushmatic panel during a remodel to a CH. This was on a 15 amp CB because 14 AWGs get a 15 at change out. We used the exemption.

We don’t know how many times the breaker was reset or how long it ran before the first trip. The house has been unoccupied for a few months so it could have run for quite some time. Damage was contained within the housing AFAIK, but dang, so close. FWIW, we added smokes during the remodel.
View attachment 21141
More details please.
What eventually de-energized the circuit?
Did the 15A breaker trip?
Was the circuit grounded?
Any idea how old the fan was?
 

peter d

Senior Member
Location
New England
It seems the HVL's burning up has become more and more common lately regardless of whether or not they are on an AFCI circuit.

Not sure what's going on.

JAP>


2 guesses - lots of lint/dust build up and cheap Chinese heating elements. I have cleaned a few over the years that were on the verge of fire due to dust.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top