why not gfci...

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charlie b

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Location
Lockport, IL
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Retired Electrical Engineer
Because you are not likely to accidentally drop the fridge into the sink. The 6' distance is based on that commonly being the maximum length of portable appliance power cords.
 
no i get the point, but than it should be required to be a single outlet.I've never dropped a washer in the sink neither but thy require it to be on the gfi if the receps within 6.
 

cowboyjwc

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Location
Simi Valley, CA
Within six feet of a sink where? In resi, it says where "...installed to serve the countertop surfaces." And in commercial it doesn't mention the refer.
 

hurk27

Senior Member
A receptacle behind a refrigerator is not considered serving the counter tops, only receptacles serving kitchen counter tops are required to be GFCI protected, if there is no GFCI requirement then there is no requirement for a single receptacle, single receptacles were only required where as an allowance for appliances fixed in-place as an exception in garages and basements to requiring a GFCI, 2008 has done away with these exceptions in basements and garages only, 210.8(7) is for wet bar sinks not kitchen counter tops.
 
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goldstar

Senior Member
Location
New Jersey
Occupation
Electrical Contractor
Because you are not likely to accidentally drop the fridge into the sink.
That depends on where you live !!!:)

I believe it also has to do with the fact that it is not readily accessible. But, on the other hand, I've been in apartments where the occupant needed another outlet, pulled out the refer, inserted an extension cord and then plugged in a triple tap into the female end to operate his TV, VCR and cable box:roll:
 

iwire

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Staff member
Location
Massachusetts
210.8 (7) 210.8 (b)(5)

I will assume 210.8(A)(7)

This is for dwelling units and there is no mention of a refrigerator.

210.8(A)(7) Sinks ? located in areas other than kitchens where
receptacles are installed within 1.8 m (6 ft) of the outside
edge of the sink


Now for other than dwellings

210.8(B)(5) Sinks ? where receptacles are installed within 1.8 m
(6 ft) of the outside edge of the sink.

Exception No. 1 to (5): In industrial laboratories, receptacles
used to supply equipment where removal of power
would introduce a greater hazard shall be permitted to be
installed without GFCI protection.

Exception No. 2 to (5): For receptacles located in patient
bed locations of general care or critical care areas of
health care facilities other than those covered under
210.8(B)(1), GFCI protection shall not be required.
 
no i missed the "installed to serve the counter-tops"it's been dogma around here for ever to have it protected within 6 feet in the kitchen. sink....are they requiring afci on the other receps in the kitchen that dont serve the counter
 

pete m.

Senior Member
Location
Ohio
no i missed the "installed to serve the counter-tops"it's been dogma around here for ever to have it protected within 6 feet in the kitchen. sink....are they requiring afci on the other receps in the kitchen that dont serve the counter

Not in a resi kitchen... 210.12 does not list the kitchen

Pete
 

Npstewart

Senior Member
I have seen posts on this in this forum and everyone always has their own opinion.

In my opinion, I think the refrigerator in a kitchen should be GFCI protected if it is within 6' of a sinks edge.

I think the NEC doesen't require a GFCI for the refrigerator because its not serving the counter top but I also think that the 6' rule superceds this requirement. Just my opinion...Safety first...If the home owner has problems with it tripping then someone else can change it out.
 

pete m.

Senior Member
Location
Ohio
I have seen posts on this in this forum and everyone always has their own opinion.

In my opinion, I think the refrigerator in a kitchen should be GFCI protected if it is within 6' of a sinks edge.

I think the NEC doesen't require a GFCI for the refrigerator because its not serving the counter top but I also think that the 6' rule superceds this requirement. Just my opinion...Safety first...If the home owner has problems with it tripping then someone else can change it out.

If you do decide to install the GFCI I don't know of any inspector that will turn you down but remember that if you are going to install the GFCI behind the fridge under the 2011 NEC you may have an issue. Secondly, I can't say that I agree that the "6 foot rule supersedes". As stated before the "6 foot rule" does not apply in a resi kitchen.

Pete
 

glene77is

Senior Member
Location
Memphis, TN
A receptacle behind a refrigerator is not considered serving the counter tops, only receptacles serving kitchen counter tops are required to be GFCI protected, . . .

Hurk,
Maybe it is just the inspector, but
I have been cited for missing GFCI at a Laundry sink, and a wet-bar sink.
Perhaps I was reading an old code book. :?
I got cited for missing a 'counter-top'
that was on the other side of a built-in cabinet (ceiling to floor)
and obviously not part of the kitchen. :happysad: 21' away from the sink.


GFCI are cheap enough to put them anywhere the inspector wants.

Wayne, you are a very experienced electrician.
 

George Stolz

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Staff member
Location
Windsor, CO NEC: 2017
Occupation
Service Manager
I think the NEC doesen't require a GFCI for the refrigerator because its not serving the counter top but I also think that the 6' rule superceds this requirement. Just my opinion...

Unless the sink you are referring to is not a kitchen sink, you are in error. 210.8(A)(6) & (7) are very clear on this point. There is no 6' requirement around a kitchen sink.

If you feel strongly about it, submit a proposal, but I don't see the problem provided the appropriate spacing is maintained elsewhere in the kitchen.
 

John120/240

Senior Member
Location
Olathe, Kansas
Back in 97 when we were on the 93 NEC we would always apply the 6' rule to residental

kitchens. Today it is all countertop recptacles must be GFCI protected. Also then we would

come off the bath GFCI & protect outside.
 
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