LED Recess Delay

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mkgrady

Senior Member
Location
Massachusetts
I have been installing recess LED fixtures. Actually it is a regular housing with a combined trim and LED bulb in one unit. It is a sylvania ultra 5" recess kit. They look good, are dimmable and are very reasonably priced.

The problem is they take a moment to turn on and they don't all turn on at once. It bothers the builder enough that he asked me not to use them on the next job. He said he would rather have a regular trim and an LED bulb.

Am I just buying the wrong kit? Is there a kit that turns on instantly?
 

mopowr steve

Senior Member
Location
NW Ohio
Occupation
Electrical contractor
At this time it could be the driver of the LED lamps that have the delay or it could be the dimmer on the wall if it is a CL Dimmer. Just something you're have to get used to. Unless the led trim lists standard dimmers it's compatable with you could try those.
 
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James L

Senior Member
Location
Kansas Cty, Mo, USA
Occupation
Electrician
I've used the 6" version, and they do the same. About a 1/3 second delay, with or without dimmers. It's the driver, as previously mentioned. I get them for $20.00, very good price from a lumber yard near me

But I've been in Lowe's a couple of times in the last week, and they've got a brand that's about $24.00 now. I would suggest buying various kinds and try them at home to find the one you can live with

I've also used screw in led bulbs, and they work good, too.
 

mkgrady

Senior Member
Location
Massachusetts
I'm surprised that there have not been numerous suggested models that don't have the delayed operation. Nobody knows of an LED recess product tha turns on instantly?
 

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
An unfortunate problem with the electronics world, there may be good reason for the delay. I don't know all the in's and out's of LED's but in the fluorescent world there is programmed start process that increases lamp life, but a similar delay at start up is a side effect.

These people are used to delays when turning on their phones, computers, or most anything else that has fairly complex microprocessor control.
 

mkgrady

Senior Member
Location
Massachusetts
An unfortunate problem with the electronics world,

These people are used to delays when turning on their phones, computers, or most anything else that has fairly complex microprocessor control.

Imagine if Edison scrapped the light bulb invention because it took .3 seconds to come on!
 

Brian S.

Member
Location
New Jersey
I've used Cree Crs6 unfortunately I never noticed if it has a delay turn on. Its a technology thing and sometimes you have to expect it as its the way of the future. have you considered using a led fixture instead of a can and a led trim.
 

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
Any delay with an LED or even a program start fluorescent is still easier to deal with as a user then the warm up period of HID's.
 

James L

Senior Member
Location
Kansas Cty, Mo, USA
Occupation
Electrician
mkgrady,

I added these led can lights today, 4" and 6". Didn't want to mention them til I had a picture of the box


The delay is so minimal that I literally had to stand as still as I could and hold my breath while flipping the switch to notice it. Maybe 1/20 of a second.

Very bright, and the 4" are being dimmed by an old rotary incandescent dimmer with no issue.

This was not my own job, I was helping a buddy get out of a scheduling jam. I've used them on his work before, at a Taco Bell I rewired last year. He gets them from City Electric Supply. Not sure if they're located where you are. They're notorious for having second rate materials, but these are nice.
 

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mirawho

Senior Member
Location
Sun Valley, CA
Drivers were mentioned, but are these self-contained lamps? It sounds like it. It doesn't matter what kit you purchase if you are using LED lamps as the fixture has no bearing on the lamp operation as it is supplying 120v. Philips has, for a while, made the best rated LED replacement lamps. Check a few reviews for what you are doing. Is this a standard A19?
 

mkgrady

Senior Member
Location
Massachusetts
I've used Cree Crs6 unfortunately I never noticed if it has a delay turn on. Its a technology thing and sometimes you have to expect it as its the way of the future. have you considered using a led fixture instead of a can and a led trim.

Have not considered fixtures as they will hang below the ceiling surface, kind of defeating the purpose of recessed lights. I have used the one that are pretty low profile and they are good in closets but not where you want light without seeing a fixture.
 

mkgrady

Senior Member
Location
Massachusetts
mkgrady,

I added these led can lights today, 4" and 6". Didn't want to mention them til I had a picture of the box


The delay is so minimal that I literally had to stand as still as I could and hold my breath while flipping the switch to notice it. Maybe 1/20 of a second.

Very bright, and the 4" are being dimmed by an old rotary incandescent dimmer with no issue.

This was not my own job, I was helping a buddy get out of a scheduling jam. I've used them on his work before, at a Taco Bell I rewired last year. He gets them from City Electric Supply. Not sure if they're located where you are. They're notorious for having second rate materials, but these are nice.
Thanks James I'll try to find some of those
 

mkgrady

Senior Member
Location
Massachusetts
Drivers were mentioned, but are these self-contained lamps? It sounds like it. It doesn't matter what kit you purchase if you are using LED lamps as the fixture has no bearing on the lamp operation as it is supplying 120v. Philips has, for a while, made the best rated LED replacement lamps. Check a few reviews for what you are doing. Is this a standard A19?
These are not lamps I have installed they are a combo trim with built in led. If the led fails the whole kit has to be replaced
 

mirawho

Senior Member
Location
Sun Valley, CA
These are not lamps I have installed they are a combo trim with built in led. If the led fails the whole kit has to be replaced

That's what I get for replying to a post when I have been up all night working. :roll: After rereading, I realized you had said that. Anyway, we have done more that a few venue installation and used the 6" 15 watt (75W equivalent) Philips trim ring. They are pretty dependable and we have had a low failure rate on these. We have used used the Cree too, but the Philips has a 45000 hour rating as compared to the Cree which is 34000. I should be retired before I know if they lasted that long.
 

Electric-Light

Senior Member
Many of the screw-ins come on instantly. I don't think it's an issue unless the delay is over half a second with the exception of vehicle activated lights and security lights.

The delayed start is meant to limit the inrush current. It prevents the breaker from tripping when many of them are turned on and it also protects the front-end components like diodes from popping and switches/contactor from pitting.
 

mkgrady

Senior Member
Location
Massachusetts
Many of the screw-ins come on instantly. I don't think it's an issue unless the delay is over half a second with the exception of vehicle activated lights and security lights.

The delayed start is meant to limit the inrush current. It prevents the breaker from tripping when many of them are turned on and it also protects the front-end components like diodes from popping and switches/contactor from pitting.
Thanks EL. That is very helpful info.

I think it's unfortunate that I will have to install LED lamps in traditional recess. They may come on quicker but they are ugly compared to the kit that includes a one piece trim and bulb
 

Electric-Light

Senior Member
I would go with a semi-fixture. They're the ones that screw in, but rather than being a bulb, it's like a fixture that retrofit into an existing fixture.

Fluorescent ballasts and lamps are standardized unless you get some Chinese made disposable garbage.

LED fixtures generally don't use universal parts. So, if the driver fails, you better hope you can find the same fixture on eBay. If you the fixture is part of multi-fixture matched set, you're so SOL.

Look at how many LED products have come and gone.
 

iwire

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Massachusetts
LED fixtures generally don't use universal parts. So, if the driver fails, you better hope you can find the same fixture on eBay. If you the fixture is part of multi-fixture matched set, you're so SOL.

Look at how many LED products have come and gone.

If there had been a forum back in the day I have no doubt there would have been someone telling us all these same things about the evil fluorescent fixtures taking over incandescent lamps. :D
 

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
If there had been a forum back in the day I have no doubt there would have been someone telling us all these same things about the evil fluorescent fixtures taking over incandescent lamps. :D
Go back even further and the evil electric lamp was taking over gas lamps. Someday there probably will be something else for light sources, and it will be evil also.
 
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