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Thread: Advice on invoices

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by George Stolz View Post
    And somehow if it doesn't work quite right we have to honor a warranty even though the work hasn't been paid for...?
    I will try to find the details.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by iwire View Post
    I will try to find the details.
    My search skills suck today.

    Best I could find. Not sure how much is applicable. I am blaming the weather.

    https://www.heuresistech.com/custome...anty-statement

    https://www.bostonglobe.com/business...ZmO/story.html

    http://www.americanbar.org/publicati..._mcgreevy.html
    "Electricity is really just organized lightning." George Carlin


    Derek

  3. #23
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    What sucks is we have many laws to protect consumers from bad contractors, and that is somewhat understandable, but there aren't much for laws to protect contractors from bad consumers. If you want to get to those "bad consumers" you pretty much need to go to court and prove they were fraudulent in some way. Many contractors eventually just fix the warranty issue the majority of the time just because even though it is a loss, it is the lesser loss then other alternatives. A couple hundred dollars to fix a "warranty item" is less then court and/or attorney fees and you may still end up fixing the problem at your cost when all is done.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by kwired View Post
    What sucks is we have many laws to protect consumers from bad contractors, and that is somewhat understandable, but there aren't much for laws to protect contractors from bad consumers. If you want to get to those "bad consumers" you pretty much need to go to court and prove they were fraudulent in some way. Many contractors eventually just fix the warranty issue the majority of the time just because even though it is a loss, it is the lesser loss then other alternatives. A couple hundred dollars to fix a "warranty item" is less then court and/or attorney fees and you may still end up fixing the problem at your cost when all is done.
    I take your point. Sometimes it's better to take the hit than try the legal route.
    But a question. If you take it to court and win can you not recover your costs?
    Not a lot of help if the errant "customer" doesn't have the means to pay for the job far less your costs for pursuing the case.

    That's why I was suggenting an up front payment to at least cover material costs.
    Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes.

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Besoeker View Post
    I take your point. Sometimes it's better to take the hit than try the legal route.
    But a question. If you take it to court and win can you not recover your costs?
    Not a lot of help if the errant "customer" doesn't have the means to pay for the job far less your costs for pursuing the case.

    That's why I was suggenting an up front payment to at least cover material costs.
    I usually get some up front payment on my bigger jobs. Some here will say that isn't necessarily legal either. Like I said there are too many laws to protect the consumer but little or no laws to protect the contractor from a bad consumer - they do exist, I have been burned by a few of them.

    If you ever are named a creditor in a bankruptcy case you get all the bankruptcy case details. Every creditor is listed, all attorney fees are listed, etc. By the time they pay the attorneys there is little money left for anyone else, and if there is any remaining money there is usually banks involved and they seem to get whatever is left, along with rights to any property that will change hands.

    Then in three years the consumer is calling you wanting some work again, they never paid you that 5 grand they once owed you, but legally you have no right to try to claim it either This may not happen in metro areas, but in small rural community you sort of know everyone to some extent, and things like that do happen.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by kwired View Post
    I usually get some up front payment on my bigger jobs. Some here will say that isn't necessarily legal either. Like I said there are too many laws to protect the consumer but little or no laws to protect the contractor from a bad consumer - they do exist, I have been burned by a few of them.

    If you ever are named a creditor in a bankruptcy case you get all the bankruptcy case details. Every creditor is listed, all attorney fees are listed, etc. By the time they pay the attorneys there is little money left for anyone else, and if there is any remaining money there is usually banks involved and they seem to get whatever is left, along with rights to any property that will change hands.

    Then in three years the consumer is calling you wanting some work again, they never paid you that 5 grand they once owed you, but legally you have no right to try to claim it either This may not happen in metro areas, but in small rural community you sort of know everyone to some extent, and things like that do happen.
    Doen't seem fair, does it?
    Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by iwire View Post
    I will try to find the details.
    You can opt out although I suspect few or no suppliers who value their reputation would do so.
    Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Besoeker View Post
    Doen't seem fair, does it?
    Nope.

    I had a dairy farm I did some work for, got some payment immediately, then nothing after that. Been long enough ago I don't remember all the details but I probably only got half what I billed them at the most. After some time had passed and they still owed me some $$, I heard they were likely going to file bankruptcy. So I placed a lien on their property, hoping that would give me some chance at getting some payment, the property can't be sold if there is current liens on it. Unfortunately the attorneys and banks got all the money available, the banks took over the real estate, and somehow got the liens removed before transfer of the real estate.

    I chalked it up as "education".

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Besoeker View Post
    You can opt out although I suspect few or no suppliers who value their reputation would do so.
    What?

  10. #30
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    We have an "acceptance of terms" on the invoice that the customer has to sign before work begins, and an "acceptance of work" they sign when complete. Get an attorney to write one for you to make sure its legal and valid.


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