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Thread: Panels in Commercial Kitchen

  1. #11
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    If it meets the definition of a wet location then install panels designed for a wet location. We have installed all stainless panels in commercial kitchens, something like a NEMA 12.
    Rob

    Moderator

    All responses based on the 2014 NEC unless otherwise noted

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by dibloafer View Post
    I am estimating a small (mom and pop) grocery build-out... it is not a dishwasher, rather, a person washing dishes in a huge dish washing area.
    Sounds like the dish washing area is bigger than the small (mom and pop) grocery.
    If they have no dining customers what is the "dish pit" for? Do they maybe have a butcher department where they have to wash knives and such? I agree with others that I doubt it will get much use but that is besides the point. If it is subject to spray or steam it needs to be dealt with.

    -Hal

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by dibloafer View Post
    I guess not. The location of the panels just looks very suspect on the drawing, but there is no solid code violation.
    I can just see some AHJ's (including myself, if I were one) being a tightwad about it
    . But why?

    Just because you have a sink next to a panel it does not mean you will have water going into the panel and go inside the breakers. Unless it is a location that gets hosed down then I would not consider it a damp location, let alone a wet location.

    It is like some people get uptight about having no GFCI under the kitchen sink just in case there is water leak from the pipes. I always say the first concern should be the leak not the lack of GFCI.
    Edward
    The only thing I know, is the progressive discovery of my ignorance


  4. #14
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    Jul 2007
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    Quote Originally Posted by hbiss View Post
    Sounds like the dish washing area is bigger than the small (mom and pop) grocery.
    If they have no dining customers what is the "dish pit" for? Do they maybe have a butcher department where they have to wash knives and such? I agree with others that I doubt it will get much use but that is besides the point. If it is subject to spray or steam it needs to be dealt with.

    -Hal
    It is a Lebanese Hookah lounge/restaurant/grocery.

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by dibloafer View Post
    Wouldn't it reflect good on me to catch this at this stage and make provisions for it? A big change order after a contract price was agreed upon, or after an inspector fails it in the late stages of the job?
    Are you competitively bidding this job?

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by growler View Post
    Mom and Pop operation, dishwashing sink. They probably won't even get used.

    I'm kind of joking but one of the restaurants around hear got something like a 32 on their heatlh inspection.

    The only inspection that may fail a panel for location is the health inspector. It wouldn't be easy to clean the grease and crud off an electrical panel and breakers. Anything in a wash down area might be considered a damp location.
    Health inspector is something else that can come into play here even if it passes electrical inspection. The panel located in the vicinity of wash area is a great place for bacterial growth to occur.

    Quote Originally Posted by hbiss View Post
    Sounds like the dish washing area is bigger than the small (mom and pop) grocery.
    If they have no dining customers what is the "dish pit" for? Do they maybe have a butcher department where they have to wash knives and such? I agree with others that I doubt it will get much use but that is besides the point. If it is subject to spray or steam it needs to be dealt with.

    -Hal
    butcher dept, bakery, deli, all would have similar sanitation requirements as a restaurant.

    Looks like your question is maybe answered:

    Quote Originally Posted by dibloafer View Post
    It is a Lebanese Hookah lounge/restaurant/grocery.

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by cdslotz View Post
    Bid it like it's drawn....ask questions later
    That's what I would do. If the design team missed something it can be discussed / questioned in the preconstruction meeting or you can submit an RFI when you get started.

    Roger
    Moderator

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by roger View Post
    That's what I would do. If the design team missed something it can be discussed / questioned in the preconstruction meeting or you can submit an RFI when you get started.

    Roger
    If competitive bidding that is about what you need to do, if you know you are doing the job and are just giving them an estimate for budgeting reasons, you need to address this now.

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by kwired View Post
    If competitive bidding that is about what you need to do,
    No "about" to it, that is what you need to do.

    Roger
    Moderator

  10. #20
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    Jul 2005
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    Quote Originally Posted by roger View Post
    No "about" to it, that is what you need to do.

    Roger

    That was the reason for my question. If you address it pre-bid in an RFI, the arch/engineer gives all of your competition the same scope to price. So the fix is now included in a competitive bid

    Don't show your hand...

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