Gray, gray and gray.

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iwire

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Staff member
Location
Massachusetts
So last night I open up a 208Y/120 panel to add some circuits to it. I found the conductor marking a bit odd. Never seen it done this way.

As a side note this building has a 480Y/277 service using Brown, Orange Yellow Gray as the identification.
 

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Cow

Senior Member
Location
Eastern Oregon
Occupation
Electrician
If the installers couldn't get something as simple as the proper phase tape, I would be VERY afraid of other things I might find.

Be careful taking any green wires apart, there's a good chance they may be hots....
 

macmikeman

Senior Member
I live in a town where people from exotic places come to and somehow become ''electrical contractors''. I see stuff like this every other day. Been into an all green panel once. Almost every wire. That one must have been from Mill Valley...
 

augie47

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Tennessee
Occupation
State Electrical Inspector (Retired)
I share the concern but, playing devil's advocate, 210.5(C) only requires identification means, not necessarily color. Identification scribbled on a piece of tape may be to poor mans answer to a Brady label maker :). The fact that they used grey as their "background" could be viewed as a violation of 200.7 but its not actually insulation, and the poor marking is likely not acceptable.
As noted in earlier posts, it is certainly a red flag for the entire job.
 

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
I share the concern but, playing devil's advocate, 210.5(C) only requires identification means, not necessarily color. Identification scribbled on a piece of tape may be to poor mans answer to a Brady label maker :). The fact that they used grey as their "background" could be viewed as a violation of 200.7 but its not actually insulation, and the poor marking is likely not acceptable.
As noted in earlier posts, it is certainly a red flag for the entire job.

I have to agree with you. Not the normal thing, but not really wrong either.

Let's just say if that is wrong then using wire markers (numbers, letters, custom labels, etc.) that are black print on a white or gray background should be prohibited on ungrounded conductors also - and that happens all the time.
 

tom baker

First Chief Moderator
Staff member
Depending on when it was installed, it may be OK. The NEC used to require the grounded conductor to be identified with white or natural gray. The phase tape is not natural gray, so it would of been OK. Natural gray was supposedly used for identification on the old rubber wire, no one knew what it was, so NEC was changed to white or gray.
 

jaggedben

Senior Member
Location
Northern California
Occupation
Solar and Energy Storage Installer
So last night I open up a 208Y/120 panel to add some circuits to it. I found the conductor marking a bit odd. Never seen it done this way.

As a side note this building has a 480Y/277 service using Brown, Orange Yellow Gray as the identification.

This is what bothers me most. 208 should be black red blue white. The words brown and orange should not be in this panel if it's really 208.
 

GoldDigger

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Placerville, CA, USA
Occupation
Retired PV System Designer
This is what bothers me most. 208 should be black red blue white. The words brown and orange should not be in this panel if it's really 208.
Use of black, red and blue for the hot lines of 208Y/120 is customary, but not specified in the Code anywhere.
What is required, however, is that it not be the same colors as used for identification of the 480Y/277 circuits.
Since the OP tells us that the higher voltage service uses brown and orange, you are quite correct that they should not be used for identification in the lower voltage panel.
Possibly the panel was converted from a 208 to a 480 panel at some time after the original installation, leaving the sub-panel ends of the feeder untouched?
 
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