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Thread: Equipment grounding

  1. #1
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    Equipment grounding

    Yellow all I have a question about grounding .the other day I ran wire to a 240v 3 phase 4 wire panel . And noticed that there was no grounding bar . Just the neutral bar . Should there not be a grounding bar for equipment grounding

  2. #2
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    Were there wire type egc's in that panel?. It's not unheard of to not have any wire egc's nor a ground bar if it's all metal conduit and the conduot system is the egc
    Ethan Brush - East West Electric. NY, WA. MA

    "You can't generalize"

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by electrofelon View Post
    Were there wire type egc's in that panel?. It's not unheard of to not have any wire egc's nor a ground bar if it's all metal conduit and the conduot system is the egc
    Yep, works fine until someone runs say a piece of MC cable to the panel and instead of adding a ground bus sticks the EGC into the neutral bus. See that a lot.
    "Electricity is really just organized lightning." George Carlin


    Derek

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by jumper View Post
    Yep, works fine until someone runs say a piece of MC cable to the panel and instead of adding a ground bus sticks the EGC into the neutral bus. See that a lot.
    Oh yeah.
    Ethan Brush - East West Electric. NY, WA. MA

    "You can't generalize"

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jay2685 View Post
    ... 240v 3 phase 4 wire panel . And noticed that there was no grounding bar ...
    So the incoming EGC was just landed to the enclosure?

    But yeah, if all metallic conduit suitable for grounding, no wires would be needed...

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jay2685 View Post
    Yellow all I have a question about grounding .the other day I ran wire to a 240v 3 phase 4 wire panel . And noticed that there was no grounding bar . Just the neutral bar . Should there not be a grounding bar for equipment grounding
    I work in several old buildings that are all conduit and there are no green wires or equipment ground busses in the panels since everything is equipment grounded by the conduit.
    If Billy Idol or John Denver is on your play list go and reevaluate your life.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by jumper View Post
    Yep, works fine until someone runs say a piece of MC cable to the panel and instead of adding a ground bus sticks the EGC into the neutral bus. See that a lot.
    Not a problem if the panel is the main service & the neutral is bonded to the can.
    If you aim at nothing, you will hit it every time!

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by electrofelon View Post
    Were there wire type egc's in that panel?. It's not unheard of to not have any wire egc's nor a ground bar if it's all metal conduit and the conduot system is the egc
    Yes the electrical sys is all metal conduit.

  9. #9
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    I'm interested in if 250.130(C)(4) would apply here>

    (4) An equipment grounding conductor that is part of
    another branch circuit that originates from the enclosure
    where the branch circuit for the receptacle or branch
    circuit originates
    I'm unsure if this is exclusively for extensions of , or new branch circuits originating from a older non-grounding OCPD enclosure

    Perhaps I'm grasping code straws , but let's say one did pick up a EGC from another source

    If it was make back to said enclosure , would it not have to serve the largest OCPD?

    ~RJ~

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jay2685 View Post
    Yes the electrical sys is all metal conduit.
    Metallic conduit and tubing is a listed EGC in 250.118 so no wire type EGC's are required. Back 30 years ago we never installed a wire type EGC in a solid metal raceway, it was considered a waste of money. It was common to see no green conductors or EGC bar in a panel.
    Rob

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    All responses based on the 2014 NEC unless otherwise noted

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