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Thread: StorEdge / LG Chem System

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by shortcircuit2 View Post
    What classification do you give the RS485 wiring? Communication-article 800? Class 2 or 3 - article 725?
    I took the cable type and size from the StorEdge installation manual. It doesn’t state the classification but, as you probably already know, the cable connects the SolarEdge meter (which measures current amount and direction between the utility meter and the main breaker) to the connection unit (which is used to manage power flow between PV, battery, service panel, auto-transformer and backed up loads panel).

  2. #12
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    So, it seems to be prohibited from being in the same raceway with power conductors by 800.133(A)(1)(c)

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by shortcircuit2 View Post
    So, it seems to be prohibited from being in the same raceway with power conductors by 800.133(A)(1)(c)
    How does it meet the article 800 definition of a communications circuit? There is no 'communications utility' involved.

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaggedben View Post
    Somewhere in the manual it says to install a 25A main breaker in the subpanel to protect the autotransformer. (Annoying, because it limits your subpanel options due to a hold down being required on that main.)
    Jaggedben, are you referring to the breaker fastener in 690.10(E) and 408.36(D)? If so, I don’t think the requirement applies to grid interactive systems like StorEdge. 690.10(E) only applies to “multimode inverters in stand-alone systems” and 705.12(D)(5) repeats that the fastener of 408.36(D) doesn’t apply to utility-interactive inverters if listed and identified as utility interactive.

  5. #15
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    Does the listing of the StorEdge system extend to the installation manual direction on installing the cables? The manual clearly shows that shielded 600V RS485 cable routed in the raceway with the inverter output circuit to the MDP.
    Anyway, it seems to be working. In my system the circuit is about 120 feet long one-way and the meter communication seems to be fine.
    One thing I’m surprised at, though, is that the response of the Energy Storage Management System isn’t precise and instantaneous. For example, when I have it in “maximize self-consumption” mode, when the air conditioner turns on during daylight the system starts importing power from the grid for about a minute before the system fully powers the load from battery and PV and zeroes out the import from grid.

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by SolarAlternativesDesign View Post
    Jaggedben, are you referring to the breaker fastener in 690.10(E) and 408.36(D)? If so, I don’t think the requirement applies to grid interactive systems like StorEdge. 690.10(E) only applies to “multimode inverters in stand-alone systems” and 705.12(D)(5) repeats that the fastener of 408.36(D) doesn’t apply to utility-interactive inverters if listed and identified as utility interactive.
    A multi-mode inverter in a stand alone system is exactly what it is, in backup mode. Also it is not an interactive output because it's the backup output. The point of 705.12 (D) is that interactive output breakers do not remain live if they accidentally pop off the panelboard busbars. The backup output of the StorEdge is precisely the opposite of that.

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaggedben View Post
    A multi-mode inverter in a stand alone system is exactly what it is, in backup mode. Also it is not an interactive output because it's the backup output. The point of 705.12 (D) is that interactive output breakers do not remain live if they accidentally pop off the panelboard busbars. The backup output of the StorEdge is precisely the opposite of that.
    I agree. The point of the exception to the breaker bolt down requirement is that that a power source that shuts down when it no longer sees a reference AC voltage does not need to be bolted down. Any power source that will continue to run under those conditions must have its interconnection breaker bolted down.

  8. #18
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    Then in the StorEdge the backfed breaker in the service panel would be exempt from 408.36(D). In the backed up loads panel 690.10(E) doesn't strictly apply because the system isn't a stand-alone system, but is the intent to interpret it as a stand-alone system during backup mode, and require the bolt down breaker in the backed up loads panel?
    Last edited by SolarAlternativesDesign; 06-15-18 at 05:02 PM.

  9. #19
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    Yes I think that's the intent. The intent is that a plug on breaker that would remain energized from the terminals when no longer plugged onto the busbar should have a hold down.

  10. #20
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    Normally a backed up loads panel would have to be fed through an ATS or MTS to isolate it from grid when grid is down.
    When that ATS is inside the standalone or hybrid inverter system, then if that connects to a backfed breaker in the panel (no main connection present) then a hold down is doubly required since it will be backfed whether POCO or backup power is going to that panel.

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