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Thread: GFCI & Storage Buildings

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dennis Alwon View Post
    210.8 for other than dwelling units states garages
    Good call. Looking more and more like Bill is gonna have to go to GFCIs.
    "Electricity is really just organized lightning." George Carlin


    Derek

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dennis Alwon View Post
    210.8 for other than dwelling units states garages
    We're still on the 08 and that's the first place I looked when making the bid. This is all the 08 shows...

    (B) Other Than Dwelling Units. All 125-volt, singlephase,
    15- and 20-ampere receptacles installed in the locations
    specified in (1) through (5) shall have ground-fault
    circuit-interrupter protection for personnel:
    (1) Bathrooms
    (2) Kitchens
    (3) Rooftops
    (4) Outdoors
    (5) Sinks — where receptacles are installed within 1.8 m
    (6 ft) of the outside edge of the sink.
    If you aim at nothing, you will hit it every time!

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Little Bill View Post
    We're still on the 08 and that's the first place I looked when making the bid. This is all the 08 shows...
    Using the 2008 and not having to make the GFCIs readily accessible saved you last time.

    2008 seems to like you.
    "Electricity is really just organized lightning." George Carlin


    Derek

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by jumper View Post
    Using the 2008 and not having to make the GFCIs readily accessible saved you last time.

    2008 seems to like you.
    To be clear, I'm not in any way "anti-GFCI". It's just the fact that I didn't recognize this particular building as anything classified as it was only a rental unit that happened to be long enough for RVs to be parked in. There are a lot of people that have RVs but don't necessarily have the room to park them at their homes. Thus the need for these type rentals.

    As I mentioned, the first place I looked was 210.8 "other than dwelling units" and I saw nothing (in the 08) that even came close to matching thse storage buildings. So my bid only contained regular duplex receptacles. The biggest "beef" I have is that the inspector started out referencing 547 for Agriculture. I knew that didn't fit. Then he mentioned a State amendment but couldn't show me the document, he told me to look it up on the State's website. I've searched the site from top to bottom and saw nothing about these type units or any GFCI amendments.
    Also, I don't usually have any problems with inspectors, and never have with this one. But he is known as the type that says "I would like to see it done like this" but no code to back it up.

    It just upset me that I had bid non-GFCI and now have to change it and he couldn't show me what he was using to require it.

    So, I'm not going to "draw swords" with the inspector on this. I explained to the customer and he has agreed to pay me for the changes. So I will change them out next week.
    If you aim at nothing, you will hit it every time!

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Little Bill View Post
    To be clear, I'm not in any way "anti-GFCI". It's just the fact that I didn't recognize this particular building as anything classified as it was only a rental unit that happened to be long enough for RVs to be parked in. There are a lot of people that have RVs but don't necessarily have the room to park them at their homes. Thus the need for these type rentals.

    As I mentioned, the first place I looked was 210.8 "other than dwelling units" and I saw nothing (in the 08) that even came close to matching thse storage buildings. So my bid only contained regular duplex receptacles. The biggest "beef" I have is that the inspector started out referencing 547 for Agriculture. I knew that didn't fit. Then he mentioned a State amendment but couldn't show me the document, he told me to look it up on the State's website. I've searched the site from top to bottom and saw nothing about these type units or any GFCI amendments.
    Also, I don't usually have any problems with inspectors, and never have with this one. But he is known as the type that says "I would like to see it done like this" but no code to back it up.

    It just upset me that I had bid non-GFCI and now have to change it and he couldn't show me what he was using to require it.

    So, I'm not going to "draw swords" with the inspector on this. I explained to the customer and he has agreed to pay me for the changes. So I will change them out next week.
    I never thought you were anti gfci by any means.

    The 547 call by inspector was wrong.

    As we both said, the 511 call was a stretch.

    Since the 2008 does not have the part about garages in 210.8, that doesn’t apply either.

    It is good that customer accepts the change and will pay, because unless that amendment exists, nothing definitive has been shown that it is required.
    "Electricity is really just organized lightning." George Carlin


    Derek

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Little Bill View Post
    To be clear, I'm not in any way "anti-GFCI". It's just the fact that I didn't recognize this particular building as anything classified as it was only a rental unit that happened to be long enough for RVs to be parked in. There are a lot of people that have RVs but don't necessarily have the room to park them at their homes. Thus the need for these type rentals.

    As I mentioned, the first place I looked was 210.8 "other than dwelling units" and I saw nothing (in the 08) that even came close to matching thse storage buildings. So my bid only contained regular duplex receptacles. The biggest "beef" I have is that the inspector started out referencing 547 for Agriculture. I knew that didn't fit. Then he mentioned a State amendment but couldn't show me the document, he told me to look it up on the State's website. I've searched the site from top to bottom and saw nothing about these type units or any GFCI amendments.
    Also, I don't usually have any problems with inspectors, and never have with this one. But he is known as the type that says "I would like to see it done like this" but no code to back it up.

    It just upset me that I had bid non-GFCI and now have to change it and he couldn't show me what he was using to require it.

    So, I'm not going to "draw swords" with the inspector on this. I explained to the customer and he has agreed to pay me for the changes. So I will change them out next week.
    That would upset me also.


    Jap>

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Little Bill View Post
    Then he mentioned a State amendment but couldn't show me the document, he told me to look it up on the State's website. I've searched the site from top to bottom and saw nothing about these type units or any GFCI amendments.
    Also, I don't usually have any problems with inspectors, and never have with this one. But he is known as the type that says "I would like to see it done like this" but no code to back it up.
    I believe any inspector is required to present the code section when he claims non-compliance, and not direct you to find it. Everyone has a supervisor for a reason. I have challenged an inspector's decision to fail my work twice, politely and respectfully, but firmly, by asking him to bring his supervisor into the decision, and I "won" the dispute both times.
    Code references based on 2005 NEC
    Larry B. Fine
    Master Electrician
    Electrical Contractor
    Richmond, VA

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by LarryFine View Post
    I believe any inspector is required to present the code section when he claims non-compliance, and not direct you to find it.
    Yes, that is written into the VA code.

    If you request it, it has to be provided.
    "Electricity is really just organized lightning." George Carlin


    Derek

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Little Bill View Post
    We're still on the 08 and that's the first place I looked when making the bid. This is all the 08 shows...
    If 2008 applies I agree with you, no GFCI required. Inspector better be able to cite location of any amendment if it applies, if not and I were you I would appeal to his superiors. If they want to claim more recent codes would require it - ask why more recent codes aren't in force. If 2008 is what applies adding GFCI here is a design decision not a NEC requirement.

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